Show 387 Notes: Clas Svahn

Simulcast, YouTube Live Streamed and on KGRA Radio Tuesday, January 14th @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-5)


Born: 12 April 1958 in Mariestad, Sweden.
Education: Journalist since 1978 after studies at Journalisthögskolan in Gothenburg.
Occupation: Journalist at Mariestads-Tidningen (Mariestad) 1978-1983, Norrbottens-Kuriren (Luleå) 1983-1990 and Dagens Nyheter (Stockholm), Sweden’s largest morning newspaper, since 1990. Works as a reviewer for UFO, science fiction and other related books for the Swedish libraries.
Family: Wife Anneli and two children, Niklas (born 1992) and Markus (born 1994).
Hobbies: UFO research, amateur astronomy.


International director for UFO-Sweden and chairman for the world’s largest archive when it comes to the unknown, Archives For the Unexplained (AFU). Founded the local organisation UFO-Mariestad on 17 May 1974, member of UFO-Sweden’s board since 1988 and chairman 1991–2013. Since 2013 Svahn is international director for UFO-Sweden and also vice chairman for the organization. Chairman of Archives For the Unexplained, AFU, in Norrköping since 2017. Editor of UFO-Sweden’s magazine “UFO-Aktuellt”. Leader of two expeditions to Lake Nammajaure in 2012 and 2014 trying two locate a sunken Ghost Rocket. Main character in the documentary ”Ghost Rockets”2015. Read more

Show #386 Notes: Sean Jablonski & David O’Leary – Ted Roe

Simulcast, YouTube Live Streamed and on KGRA Radio Tuesday, January 7th @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-5)

SEAN JABLONSKI, Showrunner/EP/Writer of HISTORY’s “Project Blue Book” A graduate of New York University’s film program, Jablonski broke into the business as a staff writer on HBO’s highly acclaimed prison drama, OZ. After his stint with HBO, Jablonski created and produced the Showtime series, THE HOOP LIFE before going on to write and produce for LAW AND ORDER and Michael Mann’s CBS drama, ROBBERY HOMICIDE DIVISION. He then served as Executive Producer (and occasional director) on FX’s NIP/TUCK for its entire six season run before writing and executive producing the first season of USA’s hit legal drama SUITS. Continuing his relationship with USA, he then created and produced the relationship drama SATISFACTION which ran for two years. Recently Jablonski served as executive producer and showrunner on the Netflix series GYPSY starring Naomi Watts before coming on as executive producer and showrunner on HISTORY’s “Project Blue Book.”

DAVID O’ LEARY A screenwriter from NYC, David O’Leary recently sold his original TV drama series “Blue Book” to History with A+E Studios and Robert Zemeckis’ ImageMovers producing. His psychological horror feature “Missing Time” is under option with Amasia Entertainment, and he was recently hired to pen the sci-fi thriller “Radiant Sky” for the Coalition Group. His work has been featured in Deadline, Hollywood Reporter, Yahoo! News, AV Club, The Hit List, Young & Hungry List, and more. He is repped by Paradigm and Zero Gravity Management and lives in Los Angeles, CA. .…

TED ROE is a co-founder and the Executive Director of the National Aviation Reporting Center on Anomalous Phenomena,, which was established in 1999. He was born and raised in Great Falls, Montana during the 1960s and 70s and his interest in UAP and UAP research arose from local events and direct experience. Alongside his work with Dr. Richard Haines and the team at NARCAP, he has established and administrates the International Association of UAP Researchers, Currently he resides on the Big Island, Hawaii, where he teaches freediving, martial arts (Iaido), and Zen meditation in addition to his duties administrating and

NARCAP just published a study of the flight dynamics of four profiles of UAP commonly associated with aviation safety incidents….


Show #385 Notes: Marc Cushman & Vic Mignogna, Star Trek Extravaganza

YouTube Live Streamed SUNDAY, December 29 @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-5)

You can see when the Star Trek set in Kingsland, GA will be open to the public here:

MARC CUSHMAN is an author and Los Angeles-based screenwriter and director. His television writing assignments include scripts for Star Trek: The Next Generation, Beyond Belief: Fact or Fiction, and Diagnosis: Murder. His feature film credits include Desperately Seeking Paul McCartney, The Magic of Christmas, and In The Eyes Of A Killer. As a writer/producer, Marc created and served as show runner for two TV series: the cult comedy Channel K and its spin-off, the original Bachelor Pad. Marc is the author of the “biography of a TV show,” I Spy: A History Of The Groundbreaking Television Series, and the definitive examination of the making of the original Star Trek series, with his 2,100 page, three-volume set, These Are The Voyages, TOS. WEBSITE:—these-are-the-voyages.html

VIC MIGNOGNA is a veteran voice actor for more than 300 animated series and video games. He also is a long time music composer, producer and performer, and the executive producer of the highly popular web series, Star Trek Continues, where he also plays Captain Kirk. WEBSITE:

Show transcript below

Podcast UFO

385. Marc Cushman & Vic Mignogna

2 weeks ago

Speaker 0 (0s):

Hello everyone. This is Martin Willis. And I’ve decided that I’m going to be offering the full show for free from now on. I really appreciate your support. Anyone can do that. All you have to do is go over to podcast You can also support us on patreon and it wouldn’t hurt if you left a review over at iTunes. I would appreciate that as well. As always. Thank you for listening and enjoy today’s show.

Hello and good tidings to all happy New Year everyone and you know, we’re running the show on Tuesday. I mean on Sunday instead of Tuesday. We’re going to be back to our regular time next week next week. We actually have a couple of executive producers from Project Blue Book the History Channel series that’s going to be finished on let’s going to be a wrapped up in the first hour in the second hour. We’re going to have

Tedrow from Hawaii he’s going to be on should be a great show next week tonight. I’m pretty excited about it. It’s a different kind of show than we normally do we may touch. Well, I hope we do touch on the UFO topic, but mostly we’re going to be focusing on Star Trek now Star Trek had a huge impact on myself and my friends when I was growing up. I don’t recall the original series actually, but I did.

Catch I think every day after school. I caught the reruns maybe a few years after I’m not sure exactly what years but I also had friends that were into it. So we talked a lot about it and I just loved the I love the original series and I’m going to be honest with you. I’ve loved the original series and I’ve loved the Star Trek movies that have come out but I’ve never got into the other the other generations of

Star Trek, but that’s just my own preferences. But anyway, I’m excited about the show our guests. We have a mark Cushman and Vic mignogna and I hope I pronounce that right so and Marcus and author and Los angeles-based screenwriter and director and his television assignments include scripts for Star Trek the Next Generation. Oh, sorry about that what I just said a few minutes ago beyond belief.

Fact or fiction. Okay and the diagnosis murder his well, he’s also we’re going to be talking about this the I spy a history of the groundbreaking television series and the definitive examinations of making of the original Star Trek series with this 2100 page three-volume set These Are the Voyages and Vic is also joining us. He’s he plays Captain Kirk does a great job.

With the series going to be talking about that and he’s been a voice actor for more than 300 animated series and a video and video games. He’s also a longtime music composer producer and performer and executive producer of what we’ll be talking about tonight a highly popular. I can’t believe how many people watching this Star Trek Continues, and I started watching myself, and I’m really loving it so far welcome to the show both of you.

Speaker 2 (3m 49s):

Thank you so

Speaker 0 (3m 49s):

much. Thank you. So I don’t even know where to begin. I mean, I’m just really excited that you could you could both join us. But let’s talk about I don’t know who wants to start it. But let’s talk about what got you interested in the series Star Trek to begin with. I mean, you’re obviously huge fans both of you. I don’t know who wants to start. Well,

Speaker 3 (4m 15s):

I’m older so I’ll go first because I did catch

Speaker 4 (4m 17s):

it on.

Speaker 3 (4m 18s):

I did catch it on NBC and big was doing the Cradle. About 10 years

Speaker 4 (4m 22s):

old and

Speaker 3 (4m 24s):

started watching it during the reruns of the first season on NBC and continued through the rest of the series and

Speaker 4 (4m 29s):

then caught

Speaker 3 (4m 29s):

up on the ones I had missed on syndication and it hooked me right away. I was the last kid in school to see it because I lived on a dairy farm in Oregon and we’re surrounded by Mountains

Speaker 4 (4m 41s):


Speaker 3 (4m 41s):

the NBC affiliate from Portland Channel 8 only came in during the summer months. It would fizzle in and be a little bit of a snowy picture but you can see it

Speaker 4 (4m 51s):


Speaker 3 (4m 51s):

so so all the kids were raving about the show called Star Trek and I’ll tell you something that

Speaker 4 (4m 55s):

really got me

Speaker 3 (4m 56s):

is one day I was in there and the teacher this is rough, but she was actually very nice start. It was a Thursday night and she started to tell us what the homework assignment was going to be and there was this Collective mon across the room and she said I know it’s Star Trek night.

Speaker 4 (5m 11s):

Okay, no

Speaker 3 (5m 11s):


Speaker 4 (5m 12s):

and I thought

Speaker 3 (5m 13s):

I don’t know what this Star Trek is but I like it and everyone was telling me about it. And it sounded great. I was still watching Lost in Space and voice mostly because those are the channels we At and the first one I got was devil in the dark the one about the horta and it caught

Speaker 4 (5m 29s):

the about

Speaker 3 (5m 30s):

half of it before the channel fizzled out. So I was kind of just straining to see this show over those summer months and then finally got to see it starting in the second season and it hooked me right away because I noticed something

Speaker 1 (5m 44s):

about it

Speaker 3 (5m 44s):

even at that young age. I knew I wanted to be a writer and writer for TV and and it was better written that. At any of the other shows. I thought this is amazing. The dialogue was crisper. The themes were stronger. It was just had such more impact on me than the other shows. I was watching especially the Irwin Allen shows and I found out later why after I met Gene Roddenberry and interviewed him for a local

Speaker 1 (6m 10s):


Speaker 3 (6m 11s):

TV station program and then

Speaker 4 (6m 14s):

came back and Pitch to

Speaker 3 (6m 15s):

him for Next Generation with the episode sarek, which he bought

Speaker 0 (6m 18s):


Speaker 3 (6m 19s):

and I asked him I said, you know, I love Book The Making of Star Trek which you guys wrote while the show was in production and it mostly focuses on the pilots and trying to get the show up and running I said and it’s filled with memos. Did

Speaker 4 (6m 32s):

you keep all those

Speaker 3 (6m 33s):

memos from all the other episodes and he said yeah, we got about 45 boxes, which is Thousands tens of thousands of memos and production reports and budgets and everything else didn’t have the Nielsen ratings. So we had the license those from AC Nielsen for every single episode. But anyway, he invited me to go ahead and do these books and he was my first interview and then he plugged me into Dorothy Fontana and John DF black

Speaker 1 (6m 56s):

and Bob Justman

Speaker 3 (6m 58s):

and on and on and then the cast members and guest stars and crew members and I just interviewed them for years knowing one day I would get around to this but I was so busy doing screenwriting that I didn’t have time to do this giant project was supposed to be one book, but when with all these memos and then when my publisher license all the Nielsen ratings and we found out that there was so much folklore out there about Star Trek. And with the ratings the show did much better than we’d ever been told everybody even today. You’ll say Star

Trek was a failure on MBC. No, it was not it quite often won its timeslot. Especially during the first season on Thursday night. It was NBC’s top-rated Thursday night show. They moved it to Friday’s it was their top rated Friday Night Show and they tried to cancel it and they got a million people who wrote in either my letters or petitions. So they renewed it and put it in the death slot fry. Friday’s from 10 to 11 and the first episode right out of the right Heather the gate for the first seat. Third season

Spock’s brain. Not a good one. But it’s one NBC wanted to lead off with what its timeslot against Judd for the defense which it won an Emmy the previous year for best dramatic series and the two-hour Premiere episode of Hawaii Five-O, which ran for 12 years. Now the ratings did come down during that third year in that terrible terrible time slot, but was still the network strongest rated show on that night for quite a ways, so

Speaker 1 (8m 22s):

It’s not true

Speaker 3 (8m 23s):

about the rating. So why did they cancel it? It’s all in the members. Every episode was a fight with the network Gene Roddenberry wanted to tell stories that had never been told on TV before he want to talk about Vietnam sexism racism religion and and these memos that are in the books that anybody can read show the battles over every single episode and you’ve also got the ratings reports and a lot of other stuff right from the files that disproves so much of the folklore about the original series.

Speaker 0 (8m 51s):

Wow. That is so amazing. I had no idea. I actually have seen what you’re talking about the memos and things like that because I was the my real life. I’m A Fine Arts and estate appraiser and I did the appraisal for the estate of Merv Griffin and I saw his notes all over Sonny and Cher show and things like that and it was more fascinating than anything else is to just to just to see what they were thinking as they were doing, you know going

along. Well

Speaker 3 (9m 21s):

in the battles they had to fight, you know, the networks were so restrictive about what an entertainment show could do in prime time and the subjects that were taboo Star Trek was crossing the barrier with everything the first interracial

Speaker 0 (9m 34s):

kiss. That’s right. The

Speaker 3 (9m 35s):

miniskirt was the first time America saw me Kurt and so many other

Speaker 4 (9m 39s):

things and

Speaker 3 (9m 41s):

I and so it was just too hot for the network is to sexy. It was too hot it was too controversial. They were trying to

Speaker 4 (9m 46s):

talk Irwin

Speaker 3 (9m 47s):

Allen into doing a show for NBC because he had lost his space on CBS. Voice vamsi and Time Tunnel and Land of the Giants on NBC and I’m sorry on ABC and so

Speaker 4 (9m 58s):

when they

Speaker 3 (9m 58s):

tried to cancel Star Trek after the second year they contacted her when and said coming into a Sci-Fi show for us and we’ll give you Star Trek’s time slot, but then they got all those protest letters and and I can guarantee you Vic did not write one of them. He was still too young. So I’ll kick it over to Vic. Yeah, because he discovered the show when you did Martin in the 1970s and reruns.

Speaker 0 (10m 18s):

I think that’s when it was in the 1970s because I come home from school and they would be you know in sometime in the afternoon and you know, but we were all talking about it at school. I don’t remember talking about it when it was out, but anything is possible because of probably about the same age as you. All right Vic. Let’s hear it.

Speaker 2 (10m 38s):

Okay. Well first of all first things first,

Speaker 0 (10m 40s):


Speaker 2 (10m 41s):

My last name is pronounced Manana.

Speaker 5 (10m 44s):


Speaker 0 (10m 44s):

gonna almost like the morning. See you tomorrow and it’s like yeah, okay

Speaker 2 (10m 49s):

Italian, but it’s pronounced like

Speaker 0 (10m 51s):

Manana okay,

Speaker 2 (10m 53s):

and I wasn’t

Speaker 0 (10m 55s):


Speaker 2 (10m 55s):

that I’d no no worries. I wasn’t in the Cradle Mark but I was I was probably close to it. I was about 7 years old when when the show was canceled in 69 and it was early 70s like 71 maybe 72 when I discovered the show. I was about nine or ten my mom and I had just moved into an apartment by ourselves. And we had very little Furniture

but I do remember that we had a 19 inch black and white television that’s sat on the floor because we had no table for it and I would come home every day after school and lay on the floor and watch this show. I I stumbled across it and I loved it the first episode I ever saw was the tholian web which was a third season episode and then I went to school and I would tell my friends about it and To my surprise a lot of them knew about it

and I started you know, Mark my started doing things because of my love for Star Trek creative things that I had never tried before. I wanted Suddenly at 10 or 11 years old 12 years old. I wanted to try to build props like they had on the show and then I wanted to make costumes like they were on the show and then I wanted to build models and then I got my parents to let me use their eight millimeter movie camera so that I could

make little episodes and rounded the kids in the neighborhood up and made them wear the costumes that I had that I had made and and Star Trek inspired me, you know, when you’re a little kid you kind of stumble across the things that you’re good at, you know, as you grow older you come across things and you try something for the first time in here. Like wow. I’m actually pretty good at this you didn’t know until that moment. When something in your life inspired you

and for that for me Star Trek was that thing. So now fast forward several decades and I’ve been a lifelong fan and then about six years ago, maybe seven now I decided even though there were a lot of fan Productions out there. They they all missed. On different levels whether it was the storytelling or the writing or the acting or the lighting or the sets or the edit or the music or

anything so many different areas of production and I thought to myself, you know, I majored in film in college and I I’ve learned I’ve studied a lot about production. I’ve been acting since I was 10 years old incidentally because of Star Trek. I started auditioning for school plays because I loved Star Trek and I wanted to do

Speaker 1 (13m 48s):


Speaker 2 (13m 48s):

Bill Shatner and Leonard Nimoy were doing and and and so I decided to take

Speaker 1 (13m 53s):

all of those skills

Speaker 2 (13m 54s):

that I’ve been working on and developing over the decades and maybe make an episode of Star Trek the way I remember it and do it as good as I could to just to pay tribute just to honor that show. So I made the first episode. I rounded a bunch of friends up who also I happen to be very gifted artists in their different fields of production, whether it be makeup or sound or lighting or camera

and and we made an episode. I self-funded it we built the studio and recreated all the sets and we made an episode called Pilgrim of Eternity which was a sequel to an original series episode called whom your listeners remember that episode and we actually got Mike Forest who played Apollo 40 years previously to reprise his role as a

polyp. We made this one episode not knowing how anyone would respond whether they would like it or not Star Trek fans are a pretty particular Bunch as I’m sure you probably know

Speaker 1 (15m 6s):


Speaker 2 (15m 6s):

lo and behold people really enjoyed it. So we launched some campaigns and we ended up making 11 full-length episodes as I told you before we came on the air every one is better than the last our own dear Mark Cushman here wrote the script for episode 5 based on a story of mine Judy Burns who wrote the tholian web wrote Our eighth episode and our series now with over 10 million

viewers picks up right where the original series was canceled and pushes The Five-Year Mission and we tell stories that explain how the Enterprise ends up in Dry Dock how it finishes The Five-Year Mission why Captain Kirk is an admiral and accepts promotion. Why is Spock back on Vulcan? We leave everybody right where they were when the motion picture begins. It is a perfect filler

between the Original Series in the motion

Speaker 0 (16m 9s):

picture well

Speaker 2 (16m 10s):

and Humbled and and gratified by so many people that have loved

Speaker 3 (16m 17s):

it Rod

Speaker 2 (16m 18s):

Roddenberry genes

Speaker 4 (16m 19s):

son. Uh-huh.

Speaker 2 (16m 21s):

Not only did he do a cameo on one of our episodes, but he publicly has stated many many times that if heard his dad were alive today, he would consider Star Trek Continues Cannon and Rod himself does contain consider it Cannon. So we’ve been very fortunate to have a great deal of Enthusiasm around her series.

Speaker 0 (16m 43s):


Speaker 3 (16m 44s):


Speaker 4 (16m 44s):

only that

Speaker 3 (16m 44s):

that I entered I heard you speak to John DF black who was the associate producer on the original first season of the original show and he’s the one who wrote the line space the final frontier and he wrote the classic episode The Naked time which won a Hugo award and John sat in as a story editor on Star Trek Continues as well and I did to to to give Vic notes on the scripts and make sure that this thing was what would be Which I’m Vic would have done anyway, but we pitched in and

helped as the best we could and to make it be like the fourth fifth season of the original Star Trek and I think he’s done an astonishing job job. It’s it’s anybody out there hasn’t seen it. Go to Star Trek and watch a couple episodes and and you’ll feel like you’re getting those those shows that we weren’t given after NBC canceled the series.

Speaker 0 (17m 36s):

Yeah, I agree. I’m in the third episode now and I wondered when I saw Apollo if that was the original actor and he’s a you know, quite an iconic. I mean, he’s a great actor really really takes the scenes, you know kind of dominates a scenes because he’s that good but

Speaker 2 (17m 56s):

I didn’t love hard and we’ve had many many guest stars from many many different iconic TV series. We’ve had people from Doctor Who we’ve had actors from Buck Rogers The Incredible Hulk Star Wars the expanse Buffy Farscape. We’ve had a lot of great guest stars throughout her and even Star Trek John de Lancie from Star Trek. Next Generation

was a guest star on one of our one of our episodes as well. Wow.

Speaker 0 (18m 31s):

Now I got to tell you the the set is just incredible. This looks like really high budget to me.

Speaker 3 (18m 39s):

How did you

Speaker 0 (18m 39s):

you said you did this through fun? Raising I can’t even imagine

Speaker 2 (18m 43s):

how could you know, we didn’t build the sets to fundraising

Speaker 3 (18m 45s):

what happened

Speaker 2 (18m 46s):

with with the sets where this was this I helped another fan production make an episode of their series and we kind of became friends and they had built a portion of the bridge and and when I decided that I wanted to make an episode of my own. I rented a facility down the street from where their their Bridge was a much larger facility. And I had them they agreed to move their bridge to the new

facility and then we all pooled our resources whether it was Labor or money or materials and we built the whole rest of the soundstage. It’s absolutely extraordinary. In fact, you know, what I would be remiss not to tell you Martin and to tell your your your listeners and your viewers The man that took over the the studio after we finished our series rate SE makes it available for people to come and enjoy to

come and walk through the Sound Stage. You’ll feel like you’re 10 years old again walking through the original Enterprise. It is euphoric.

Speaker 4 (19m 54s):


Speaker 0 (19m 54s):

is it located? It’s

Speaker 2 (19m 56s):

in Kingsland, Georgia you fly into Jacksonville Florida, but if you miss everything else that has said neutral zone There is listed on that site open house dates where you can go and take a tour of the studio sit in the captain’s chair step up on the transporter platform and I love those sets so much because I helped build them and and help

create them. I go down there myself personally and give people tours of the studio old

Speaker 0 (20m 32s):


Speaker 2 (20m 32s):

I’ll be down there. I’ll be down there on January 18th coming up very soon. They’ll be another open house in February and March. So we built the entire Sound Stage based on original floor plans. So when so what you’re seeing on our series is I would dare say it’s within inches

Speaker 0 (20m 53s):


Speaker 2 (20m 53s):

the original the original Sound

Speaker 0 (20m 55s):

Stage. Well, you know, I got to tell you I actually touched the carpet that was in the original series. I was at a I was in LA at a auction house that handles like like things from props and things from from different, you know series and movies and they had sheet that at the time he had Marilyn Marilyn Monroe’s dress Subway dress ever leave. It sold for 600,000 or maybe even more maybe it was two million or I can’t even

remember. But anyway, I saw rolled up when I was there was talking to Joe. I can’t remember his last name Magdalena is something like that and I saw this rolled up jagged. Carpet and I just pointed to Anise of what’s that anyway, because it was among all a bunch of Star Trek things. And he said, oh that’s the original carpet from the original series from the bridge.

Speaker 4 (21m 49s):


Speaker 2 (21m 49s):

my goodness.

Speaker 0 (21m 50s):

So I followed up here and it sold for $11,000

Speaker 4 (21m 53s):


Speaker 0 (21m 54s):

someone had to have it. Yeah. Yeah, but that’s really it’s an amazing job you did with that sets the sets so really really nice drop

Speaker 2 (22m 3s):

your well, I would encourage you and anyone else who’s a Star Trek. Fan it’s like dying and going to heaven. I got to tell you there is nothing quite like it and I don’t know if you know this or not Martin, but all of this all of the rooms are connected to that bending Corridor.

Speaker 4 (22m 20s):

Hmm, they’re

Speaker 3 (22m 20s):

all connected

Speaker 2 (22m 21s):

to the corridor. In other words. Once you step into the corridor at one end and start walking down the corridor. You’re on the ship. You can walk right into Sick Bay right into the transporter

Speaker 3 (22m 33s):


Speaker 2 (22m 33s):

right into the briefing room right into the captains quarters. Jefferies tube, all of it is connected. So you feel like you’re actually there it is an amazing thing to see and if you go to Star Trek and you click on the on one of the tabs across the top on the word about you’ll find a 3D virtual tour of the studio where you can actually

Speaker 3 (23m 1s):


Speaker 2 (23m 2s):

the keys on your computer to cursor through and walk through and look all Oh around and be able to see the studio.

Speaker 0 (23m 10s):

Well, we’re going into a break here in just a couple minutes, but have either one of you ever watched the I have a friend Roger Nygaard and he made a film called documentary called trekkies. Did you ever see that? Yeah, it’s kind of like following the this guy there. It’s a super fans. Now you mentioned earlier have you have either one of you had an encounter with a super fan that

Speaker 2 (23m 37s):

Absolutely. In fact, I’ll let you in on a little something Martin. There was a young man that was in trekkies. Who was the young boy who was really the Super Fan named Gabe. Koerner. He was the one that outfitted his his family’s van to look like the shuttlecraft and he was such a hardcore fan. Oh, he grew up to become a special effects CGI guy, and he actually did some work on Star Trek Continues.

Speaker 0 (24m 6s):

Oh my God. And we had just a minute here Mark. How about yourself? Have you had any encounters with superfans that I mean they can you know, people can actually troll you these days when it comes to this subject and I’m sure you do.

Speaker 3 (24m 27s):

Oh, yeah, good and bad.

Speaker 4 (24m 29s):

Yeah and

Speaker 3 (24m 30s):

one Gerald Gurion is I think the biggest collector of Star Trek

Speaker 4 (24m 35s):


Speaker 3 (24m 36s):

anywhere and including the film trims from the editing room floors from the original series. And when I did my three-volume set These Are the Voyages Gerald contributed a lot of the pictures that are in these books which were outtakes or alternate takes and things like that. So as you’re reading about the the Can you the episode you’ve got these pictures in there of those particular scenes that were talking about things of that nature and you know, they’re just terrific people

and and when you look at all the technology that’s come out of Star Trek the inventions like the communicator and everything else or I’m sorry, the the communicator became the cell phone and Spock’s computer became the internet the PC and it was kids watching the show who grew up and said, why can’t we have

Speaker 4 (25m 22s):


Speaker 3 (25m 22s):

and invented that stuff. So even people who aren’t fans of Star Trek their lives have been impacted. I start Trek.

Speaker 0 (25m 28s):

Absolutely. I wanted to get into that. All right, we’re going to go into the break. All right, this is Martin Willis. I have my oh my God. I hope I say his name right? We have

Speaker 4 (25m 38s):

Jana like

Speaker 2 (25m 39s):


Speaker 4 (25m 40s):


Speaker 0 (25m 40s):

and Vic mignogna and we’re coming right back. I did it right after these messages. All right, we are back and we are talking Star Trek mark up. I want you if you would to go into the topic of These Are the

Voyages and what what kind of undertaking as far as the Amount of time in years and effort. Did you have to put into that?

Speaker 3 (26m 21s):

Oh, it was massive just like for Vic when he did the audio book that’s out now, which is 28 hours long

Speaker 4 (26m 27s):

and has

Speaker 2 (26m 27s):

a cast

Speaker 3 (26m 28s):

of 80 plus people. So he went through a great deal of work creating that audiobook which is based on

Speaker 4 (26m 35s):

my books

Speaker 3 (26m 36s):

the that’s why it took me so long to do it because I first met Gene Roddenberry in 1982 when I interviewed him and then I get a 19 89 I think is when I pitch sarek to them and so I started collecting all these materials that he gave me access to it that point tens of thousands of memos production reports everything. We got the Nielsen ratings as I mentioned and I’ve been interviewing. So I interviewed people over a period of 20 years knowing that one day. I was going to write these books

as soon as I had time because I knew they were just going to be a huge job and it was supposed to be

Speaker 1 (27m 11s):

one book,

Speaker 3 (27m 12s):

but it was just too much material. So we did one book for each season. And a chapter for each episode that’s 10 15 sometimes 20 pages long like for the city on the edge of forever because there were so many memos and so much back and forth over the writing of that script and then the production and so on so it as you’re collecting all that material you’re going. Oh my God, this is going to take years to do. Well it did it took about a year per book once I actually started writing and putting all this material together. And

so it was twenty years of research in my spare time and In three full years of writing to do these three books and they came out one year apart each one

Speaker 0 (27m 52s):

of them and how have they been received by the I want to say the real hardcore track? He’s

Speaker 3 (28m 0s):

incredibly incredibly they’ve sold well and and the we get letters all the time from people and how much they love them. But what really means a lot to me is the actual participants of Star Trek. I mean Dorothy Fontana she read All three of the books give me notes

Speaker 0 (28m 18s):

only try to

Speaker 3 (28m 19s):

get anything wrong. So DC Fontana’s giving me notes. I’m putting her notes into the books for on every script they made and so forth

Speaker 4 (28m 27s):

and Bob Justman

Speaker 3 (28m 28s):

was giving me notes on the books and John DF black was giving me notes on the books. Jean had passed away at that point wasn’t able to get these done in time for him to see but Rod loves the books and God did the prologue for the audiobook so, you know all them Leonard Nimoy called me and said yeah and I and we I let his quote was great because it just sounded

Speaker 0 (28m 52s):

like Spock

Speaker 3 (28m 53s):

on the phone and he said Mark these books aren’t the research is astounding and it was like Spock saying it and at Harlan Ellison called and blew me away because I don’t think Harlan’s ever complimented anybody, you know how he’s such a difficult person as far he’s so to go of other people’s work and he wrote the course the classic episode City on the edge of forever and he called me up and I saw his name appear on my phone and it was like, oh God because we just met him a copy of the book and his interviews are in there with everybody

else’s and and I said hi Harlan think he was just going to rip me to pieces and he says Mark

Speaker 4 (29m 29s):

I’m not

Speaker 3 (29m 29s):

going to say they’re they’re awesome because

Speaker 4 (29m 32s):


Speaker 3 (29m 33s):

a word I reserved for Eleanor Roosevelt and the Grand Canyon, but they come close it was like I was trembling Until he said that and then there was this heavy sigh of relief and he started laughing and I did not expect to get that from Harlan Ellison, but and Judy Burns

Speaker 4 (29m 50s):

called up and

Speaker 3 (29m 51s):

I introduced her to evict because she told me when I interviewed her for the Foley and Web chapter. She said that if there had been a fourth season they were going to do a sequel to that that show she down and ID and pitched it and they all loved it because it went in a very unexpected Direction and she had been wanting to write. That’s script and I was at working with Vic at that point on Star Trek Continues giving him notes on scripts and so forth. So I called him up and I said Jude he’s got a great story and I pitched it to

him and he loved it. And so they got together and she ended up writing. What was that one called Vic

Speaker 2 (30m 27s):

still Treads the shadow.

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Speaker 4 (30m 31s):


Speaker 3 (30m 31s):

and it picks up where Foley and web

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Speaker 3 (30m 34s):

off and and very surprising direction that it goes. So it’s a terrific episode of Star Trek Continues and one of my favorites of the original series. So get at she called me up and said these should be required reading in

Speaker 4 (30m 48s):

all colleges

Speaker 3 (30m 49s):

that have screen writing classes because when you read these things and you see the memos from Roddenberry and from NBC on every episode including ones that never got made from a lot of very famous science fiction writers that they just couldn’t afford to produce or they were too edgy for television at that time. But when you read all these memos it gives you a cop. Each course in how to construct a great story

Speaker 4 (31m 14s):

and and that’s

Speaker 3 (31m 14s):

why when I was a kid and I sense that this was like the best written show on TV. You read these memos and you see why these people really cared

Speaker 4 (31m 22s):

and they were

Speaker 3 (31m 23s):

all so bright and they just understood about

Speaker 4 (31m 26s):


Speaker 3 (31m 27s):

Kirk lead the story and about having a strong theme and emotional

Speaker 4 (31m 30s):

theme and conflict

Speaker 3 (31m 31s):

between the characters and so it’s a real education

Speaker 4 (31m 35s):


Speaker 3 (31m 36s):

I ask Vic the other day if if after He read the did the audio book if it had changed his feelings about the show what he watched it if he appreciated it even more being a great fan to begin with and I’ll let him tell you the answer. He gave me the

Speaker 2 (31m 52s):

other day. Absolutely. I was just blown away. In fact to coin a phrase fascinated by all of the all of the information that went into that series, you know, Martin, you know, the old saying necessity is the mother of invention.

Speaker 0 (32m 7s):


Speaker 2 (32m 10s):

That was never more true than in the making of Star Trek.

Speaker 3 (32m 13s):

Oh, yeah,

Speaker 2 (32m 14s):

I tell you what, you know everybody on the planet Earth Martin everybody on the planet Earth knows what you’re talking about when you’re say when you say beam me up. Yeah beaming down.

Speaker 4 (32m 26s):

Yeah and

Speaker 2 (32m 27s):

yet when I read these books I learned for the first time. Do you know how they came up with the idea for the transporter Martin?

Speaker 0 (32m 37s):

No, I’ve heard. A lot of different things but not about that one.

Speaker 2 (32m 42s):

I mean what it was they couldn’t afford to have the ship land on a planet every week.

Speaker 4 (32m 49s):


Speaker 2 (32m 50s):

just was it was financially impossible to do the special effects required to make this giant ship land on a planet every week. So they came up with this idea where they could somehow get from the ship to the planet. They literally were just you know franek to figure something out and they needed to come up with a reason with a way to save costs and and now

the things that they came up with and and when you read the book or better yet, listen to the book when you listen to the book, what you find is that they came up with all of these iconic things and some of these amazing stories that we all remember so well almost out of necessity. and and originating ideas that are now part of our everyday vernacular. I was just I was absolutely

I was absolutely Blown Away by by what it took for them to create each of these episodes.

Speaker 4 (33m 57s):


Speaker 3 (33m 58s):

I believe that memos in the

Speaker 4 (33m 60s):


Speaker 0 (34m 0s):

on that particular

Speaker 3 (34m 1s):

subject Roddenberry came up with the idea

Speaker 0 (34m 4s):


Speaker 3 (34m 5s):

an in a memo, you know, he said this will not only save us a lot of money and allows to stay. Budget but it will get us into the story

Speaker 4 (34m 15s):

quicker. You can

Speaker 3 (34m 16s):

just open up the story Captain’s Log and they step onto the transport of thing and they are down there on the planet and he said this is going to be such a fast way to get to the action and get to the danger and get to the stuff to hook the audience before we go into the first commercial. And so and I got another example, right right from what Vic was

Speaker 0 (34m 35s):

talking about

Speaker 3 (34m 36s):

the the Vulcan mind

Speaker 2 (34m 40s):

probe. Yes.

Speaker 3 (34m 41s):

Oh man, it’s amazing. That’s when the first book to and so that’s in the audio book as well.

Speaker 4 (34m 46s):

They did an episode called dagger the mine

Speaker 3 (34m 48s):

early in the first season and it was about a guy Simon vangilder who escaped from a penal

Speaker 4 (34m 53s):


Speaker 3 (34m 53s):

and he gets bored the Enterprise and and he’s trying to tell them what has been

Speaker 4 (34m 59s):


Speaker 3 (34m 59s):

down there, but he can’t because he’s been subjected to a neural neutralizer probe that prevents him from ask accessing these memories and so in the script Spot

Speaker 4 (35m 12s):

Kirk’s down on

Speaker 3 (35m 13s):

the planet but in the script Spock and McCoy hypnotized and gelder so that he can tell them what

Speaker 4 (35m 19s):

he’s been trying to tell them

Speaker 3 (35m 21s):

and it won’t be blocked and NBC the memos in the book. You can read it. It says, you know, you cannot do this. You cannot hypnotize somebody on the NBC television network because they were afraid they were afraid people watching might become hypnotized if they saw a watch going back

Speaker 0 (35m 35s):

and forth my something like that

Speaker 3 (35m 37s):

and Roddenberry wrote back to Stan Robertson at NBC nice is Liz. We need to do this to make the story work and he’s add up. It’s against broadcast standards. So Roddenberry sat down and thought well, how can we do this? These are I know I’m going to have Spock

Speaker 4 (35m 52s):


Speaker 3 (35m 52s):

van gelder’s head and say remember remember whatever he says and and get and get the words to come out and then Spock is speaking the words for Van gelder telling about the neural neutralizer and whatever is going on down there which is now happening to Kirk Who’s down on the planet and and so it was stuff like that. That because they had to get around the sensor and

Speaker 0 (36m 15s):

these are things I never even

Speaker 3 (36m 17s):

imagined but when you go through the memos and you see all this stuff, it’s my God. Every episode was a battle

Speaker 0 (36m 23s):

I can I can totally believe that I remember when Spock did it with did that with that rock living rock that was in a minor?

Speaker 3 (36m 32s):

Yeah the horta that was that was the first episode I saw in reruns

Speaker 0 (36m 36s):

always a trend

Speaker 3 (36m 37s):

but that was done that was done a couple months later and if they hadn’t come

Speaker 4 (36m 40s):

up with that Vice

Speaker 3 (36m 43s):

plot device in that earlier episode they wouldn’t have been able to do the the horta

Speaker 4 (36m 46s):


Speaker 2 (36m 47s):

you got they found multiple episodes that followed opportunities to use the Vulcan mind meld and you know what? You know what Martin the neck pinch. Yeah,

Speaker 3 (36m 58s):

there was

Speaker 2 (36m 58s):

a script where this there was an episode where the script called for Spock to punch somebody and Spa and and Leonard Nimoy was like II don’t think Spock would just punch people. He’s not like a Brute Force. Kind of guy so just like on the spot they come up with these things that are now just like I say, they’re part of our culture and everybody knows about them, but they were created in these moments of necessity

Speaker 4 (37m 24s):


Speaker 0 (37m 24s):

that mm. Yeah,

Speaker 3 (37m 25s):

it was you supposed to give the guy a judo chop and Nimoy they were

Speaker 4 (37m 29s):

on the set.

Speaker 3 (37m 31s):

And and this was for the Enemy Within which I think was the fourth episode. They filmed of the series after the two pilots and the more he said he just wouldn’t do this and Leo pain was Acting as a father Sean Penn and and Nimoy’s talking to Leo pain and saying, you know, so he provoked and would not do this. But you know, I got an idea Vulcans know all about the human electromagnetic system and everything else and we they would know there’s a pressure point between the neck and the shoulder blades where you could

actually knock somebody out. If you put pressure there and Leo Pence’s. Oh really? And he says, oh, yeah. Yeah, it works. He say Bill and Shatner was on the set but hadn’t heard what they read. I’m talking about this is Bill come over here. And so Shatner walks over and he says I was telling

Speaker 4 (38m 15s):

Leo about the

Speaker 3 (38m 17s):

Vulcan neck pinch and he doesn’t believe it. So I wanted to show him how it works. Do you mind if I do it to you and shatter says

Speaker 4 (38m 23s):

no go ahead

Speaker 1 (38m 24s):


Speaker 4 (38m 25s):


Speaker 3 (38m 26s):

then way reaches over and squeezes his neck and Shatner without even knowing this is how fast Bill Shatner is without even knowing what the whole thing was about but he caught on Heroes his eyes up into his head and he just collapses to the floor real pain is That’s incredible. Are you okay? Mr. Shatner? Are you alright he

Speaker 4 (38m 44s):

cut a little

Speaker 3 (38m 44s):

groggy but he says yeah, I’m I’m okay the help them up and he says all we got to do this and so they filmed it that way. Well the next day Roddenberry and Bob Justman and John Dee of lacquer in dailies watching the footage and they see that and there’s a memo in the book for that episode where Gene Roddenberry rights Leonard Nimoy letter and just tear them to Pieces over it politely but professionally and says you can never do this again. When you don’t know what we’re writing for the next episode of the episode about

that, you can’t change a script like that after it’s been approved by the network and and this letter goes on for about a page and a half and he’s just bringing letter Nimoy to task and then the last line says but we’re going to keep this and we’re going to start putting in scripts sincerely lot of very

Speaker 4 (39m 31s):


Speaker 0 (39m 31s):

amazing. I feel like I could talk about this forever and ever and it’s just so amazing but one of the things I want to talk about right now if it’s all right with a bow. You is the actors to I think are great luck. I saw the first pilot and it’s with a different actor. Not not William Shatner. Yeah, and I think

Speaker 4 (39m 55s):

William Shatner

Speaker 0 (39m 56s):

did a much better job. All right, everybody.

Speaker 3 (39m 59s):


Speaker 0 (39m 59s):

it. Yeah, but also he’s amazing. He is 88 years old. He’s still full of total energy as someone I saw that I forget who it was. I went to meet him and he was like still so full of energy at 88 when I was eight years old. He wrote across the country on a motorcycle. He’s an amazing guy. And then Leonard Nimoy. Oh my goodness. When when he passed away. I just saw that billboard with that

said he did and you didn’t even have to under you know, if you ever watch Star Trek, you know exactly what that meant. He lived long and prospered and yeah, yeah. That must have been really exciting to talk to him. I’ve always I always thought and there was a documentary out about his life. I thought was fascinating. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (40m 50s):

I helped out on that

Speaker 4 (40m 52s):

Adam Adam

Speaker 3 (40m 54s):

directed and produce that for the love of Spock.

Speaker 0 (40m 58s):

I believe it’s called yes grand

Speaker 4 (41m 0s):


Speaker 3 (41m 1s):

I was I was a consultant on that because Leonard

Speaker 4 (41m 3s):


Speaker 3 (41m 4s):

Adam come call me. So I get a phone call out of the blue from a Des Moines, and he says my dad told me to call you. Because of the books you wrote he’s as you know Star Trek better than anybody and so let and you got all the memos and you got all this stuff. So would you help us with this thing? So, you know I met with them and I just as a very minor thing just just was like a consultant for him and I think it’s a beautiful beautiful movie and and Leonard was going to be part of that. They were

doing that together and Leonard passed away just days before they were going to shoot his Interview segments,

Speaker 0 (41m 43s):

so it kind

Speaker 3 (41m 44s):

of stalled it for a for a bit. But then Adam said no, we’re going to go ahead and finish it and it’s a wonderful show if anybody hasn’t seen it for the love

Speaker 0 (41m 51s):

of Spock. Yeah. Yeah, it’s really good. And there are so many actors that were just amazing and so many catchphrases you hear out there, you know people still like, you know with the it’s going to blow Captain. Do you know I mean, there’s

Speaker 4 (42m 7s):

just you can do no more you know

Speaker 3 (42m 10s):

it by the way and start Rick continues Scott he’s played by Chris Duhon James Doohan son, and he looks so much like his father says so much like his father. It’s amazing. I

Speaker 4 (42m 20s):

didn’t realize it till you Hon. Oh my

Speaker 3 (42m 22s):

goodness. Yeah. I

Speaker 4 (42m 24s):

did a

Speaker 3 (42m 25s):

I was called in to do a thing for the History Channel a 50-year anniversary do the three hour show on Star Trek and they called everybody and Dorothy Fontana was in the makeup chair right before me and she got interviewed him and they brought me in and then they brought in people. Awesome, and we all do our little testimonial things. We’re answering questions. And I said something on that show. It just occurred to me Mark Alton was behind the camera asking the questions and and I

Speaker 4 (42m 53s):

said and

Speaker 3 (42m 53s):

he mentioned what you just did Martin

Speaker 4 (42m 55s):


Speaker 3 (42m 56s):

the the cast and what it would have been like and I said, you know Star Trek was like the Beatles of TV in the 1960s. And if you’d taken the four Beatles And if you

Speaker 4 (43m 7s):

taken any

Speaker 3 (43m 7s):

one of them out of the group John Lennon Paul McCartney George, Harrison Ringo Star it wouldn’t have been the same. It was just this magical grouping of four people that made

Speaker 0 (43m 18s):

that happen. And

Speaker 3 (43m 19s):

I said the same thing with Star Trek if you if you took Bob Justman or Dorothy

Speaker 4 (43m 24s):


Speaker 3 (43m 25s):

or jin-kun or Gene Roddenberry out of the mix. It would have been the same show and if you took William Shatner Leonard Nimoy DeForest Kelley or James Doohan out. It wouldn’t have been the same show, you know, it’s just the caliber of talent

Speaker 4 (43m 38s):


Speaker 3 (43m 38s):

how they connected it creates.

Speaker 4 (43m 41s):


Speaker 3 (43m 41s):

that magical thing that is hard to understand how it came about but it’s almost like fate

Speaker 0 (43m 47s):

right I’d like to talk about if either one of you know about how close Star Trek came to not happening. I mean there was a lot of hurdles that had to be jumped over. Is that right?

Speaker 2 (44m 2s):

Oh, absolutely.

Speaker 3 (44m 4s):

First of all, well, I’ll tell you how it got

Speaker 4 (44m 6s):


Speaker 3 (44m 7s):

Lucille Ball was running Desi Luke. She and Jesse started the studio. Go with

Speaker 4 (44m 11s):

the money they

Speaker 3 (44m 12s):

had made from I Love

Speaker 2 (44m 13s):

Lucy reruns.

Speaker 3 (44m 15s):

And the reason they made the money is because I

Speaker 4 (44m 17s):

look back

Speaker 3 (44m 17s):

then all sitcoms

Speaker 4 (44m 18s):

were done

Speaker 3 (44m 19s):

live out of New York and they would

Speaker 4 (44m 20s):

take them off

Speaker 3 (44m 21s):

a TV screen on the west coast to make it kinescope to are three hours later. And that’s how they want to do. I Love Lucy but Desi and Lucy lived in LA and they wanted to stay there. So Desi said,

Speaker 4 (44m 33s):


Speaker 3 (44m 33s):

do it on film with three film cameras in front of a studio audience. He invented

Speaker 4 (44m 37s):

that technique and

Speaker 3 (44m 39s):

and Harry Ackerman CBS said, well that’s going It’s too much and he said I’ll pay the difference if I can have the reruns and I’m not joking the response he got from CBS was what’s a rerun

Speaker 4 (44m 51s):

there’s never been

Speaker 3 (44m 51s):

one everything it was live and and

Speaker 4 (44m 54s):

the kinescopes were not good enough

Speaker 3 (44m 55s):

quality to do it. I mean, you can look at the role Honeymooners and you see how bad they look for that for that very reason and so after a couple years of being number one on CBS, they came to Lucy and Desi and said we want to buy back the reruns and gave them a few million dollars. Hours and they use that money to buy RKO and turned it into desilu Productions and started filming. Everybody else is shows Andy Griffith if Dick Van Dyke all those shows but they didn’t

Speaker 4 (45m 20s):

own them and and

Speaker 3 (45m 22s):

and so

Speaker 2 (45m 22s):

after Desi was gone

Speaker 3 (45m 23s):

Lucy was running the reluctantly the president of desilu and she told her staff bring me a show that could rerun as long as I Love Lucy is going to rerun and they brought her Star Trek her solo and Oscar cats broader Star Trek and she believed in it and she was the champion and her board of directors even after NBC ordered a pilot tried to talk her out of making it and that was the one you mentioned Martin with Jeffrey Hunter and they rejected it as being too cerebral but

Speaker 4 (45m 52s):

they ordered another pilot

Speaker 3 (45m 53s):

which had never happened before and that first pilot

Speaker 4 (45m 56s):

cost 700,000

Speaker 3 (45m 57s):

dollars once was just unheard of in those days and so they did the second one where no man has gone before which costs about 500,000

Speaker 4 (46m 6s):


Speaker 3 (46m 7s):

and desilu

Speaker 4 (46m 7s):

had to put up half the money

Speaker 3 (46m 8s):


Speaker 4 (46m 9s):

put up half the money

Speaker 3 (46m 10s):

and then he said we’ll take it and they put in an order for 16 episodes which back then was half a season. And again, the board of directors tried to talk Lucy out of doing it. They said it’s going to bankrupt the studio and she went with it. Anyway, well, it did bankrupt the studio and halfway through the second season. She had to sell dizzy Luda Paramount. And the first thing they did was they cut the budget to Star

Speaker 4 (46m 32s):

Trek and

Speaker 3 (46m 32s):

Bob Justman. There’s a memo in the third season book where he says, he says we’re trying to do half a science fiction movie a week on the budget of a radio show. That’s why the third season isn’t quite as good generally speaking as the first two but there are still many many excellent episodes in that third season and and it’s still Star Trek, you know, but

Speaker 4 (46m 52s):

but that

Speaker 3 (46m 52s):

it was a challenge to get it on because it was something

Speaker 4 (46m 56s):

that had not been

Speaker 3 (46m 57s):

done and it was going to cost so much and then it was a challenge to keep it on because the stories were too hot for MBC

Speaker 0 (47m 5s):

interesting. Wow, totally amazing Vic as far as your Action goes did you have any big hurdles to get over or how did that

Speaker 3 (47m 15s):

all work?

Speaker 2 (47m 16s):

Oh, yeah, and I’ll tell you something one of the things that I made me laugh when I read the books when I recorded the audio book for These Are the Voyages I was amazed at how many things how many hurdles and how many difficulties they had in making the original series that we had exactly the same. It was so funny it sounded so Familiar there, you know there are always

challenges in production. But if you consider Martin that you’re bringing together a bunch of people and you can’t Star Trek as a licensed property, so you can just make Star Trek and sell it.

Speaker 4 (48m 0s):

You can’t

Speaker 2 (48m 1s):

profit from somebody else’s property now, that’s not why we made Star Trek Continues. We made it to pay tribute to the series. We pay we made Star Trek Continues out of love. Love and to honor the original series not to make a penny everybody coming into the production knew from the get-go. I sat everyone down ahead of time. And I said now we’re going to have a lot of fun and you’re going to be a part of something very special but there’s no money to

be made here

Speaker 0 (48m 32s):

like zero

Speaker 2 (48m 33s):

everybody know that right off it right off the bat, but everybody was involved and I got to tell you. For us to make 11 full length episodes. I’m talking like our long just like the original series. Eleven full-length episodes across a five-year run with 30 or 40 production people and I could count on one hand. The number of people that we lost along the

way well is unheard of we had virtually no attrition. We have the same people. We very much became like a family we have the same people come back twice a year and and we would make episode. Together we would descend on this wonderful little town and in Georgia and and spend eight or ten days. They’re shooting an episode and we had all of the challenges of a regular television show. And the funny thing

was that you don’t have you’re not you’re not paying people tons of money. So you don’t have any leverage. You know what I mean? You can’t say I’m going to dock your pay or I’m going to fire you and hire somebody else you are basically at the mercy of the the Goodwill of everybody involved the actors the production people Everyone you’re hoping that they are as committed to this project as you are and unfortunately they all

were and that even though we did have a lot of challenges we overcame them very much in the same way the original series production team did and I’m so so proud of everyone that worked on on Star Trek Continues.

Speaker 0 (50m 17s):

Yeah. Yeah. I can’t wait to watch it. I mean I’m I meant the third episode and I’m hooked

Speaker 2 (50m 23s):

for you to watch it. Like I told you everyone just gets better and better and

Speaker 0 (50m 27s):

better. Yeah. Yeah, and you do an excellent Captain Kirk by the way,

Speaker 4 (50m 32s):

you look

Speaker 0 (50m 32s):

a little bit like a

Speaker 2 (50m 38s):

and Captain Kirk was a role model to me. I mean like I mentioned earlier in your show my mom and I moved into an apartment by ourselves. My dad was gone. And there was this guy on this show. He was handsome and

Speaker 3 (50m 53s):


Speaker 2 (50m 54s):

and and brave and he went on these adventures and he and he and he protected his friends and he and Captain Kirk very much became a father figure to me. So when it came time to start this series and to play that character it was a little scary because I wanted it so much to be good. I wanted so much to to pay Shatner and Star

Speaker 3 (51m 22s):

Trek the the

Speaker 2 (51m 23s):

tribute and the honor that they were do so it was it was a big challenge. But the last thing I ever wanted would be for anyone to think that I was doing some kind of a satire some kind of a parody

Speaker 1 (51m 36s):


Speaker 2 (51m 36s):

of Kirk like a lot of you know comedians will do the

Speaker 1 (51m 39s):

you know, you

Speaker 2 (51m 40s):

don’t know that kind of thing.

Speaker 0 (51m 41s):

Yeah. Well, what about the hesitation you’re not doing.

Speaker 2 (51m 45s):

Well, you know what? I’ll tell you I’d let me in. Answer that here’s what I will tell you about that Martin. Whenever we would shoot an episode I would take the first ad the assistant director. I would take him aside and I would say now listen Scott whose name was Scotty Scotty Whitehurst Scotty, if you see me doing too much Shatner, let me know huh? If I Do too much.

Speaker 4 (52m 14s):

Just let me know

Speaker 2 (52m 16s):

and and he did and we would shoot a scene and he would pull me aside occasionally and he would say that there was a little too much that go in there and I’m like, okay, let’s do it again. So my goal was to make people feel like they were watching the same characters but not a parody of those characters not a satire of those characters, you know. No offense to Chris Pine, but we don’t need a

reimagining of Captain Kirk Shatner

Speaker 3 (52m 50s):

wrote the book.

Speaker 2 (52m 51s):

He is Kirk I’ve spent enough time around him to know he is Captain Kirk and and so my desire was not to reinvent or reimagine the character, but merely to pay homage to him and make our viewers feel like they were watching the same characters. Sure. Their faces were a little different and it’s it’s been 50 years, but most of our fans say that after 10 minutes they feel like they’re watching episodes that were locked in a

vault somewhere for 50

Speaker 0 (53m 22s):

years. Yeah. That’s what am I feeling

Speaker 2 (53m 23s):

it the better compliment than

Speaker 0 (53m 25s):

that? Yeah, I agree with that comment.

Speaker 4 (53m 29s):

How about William

Speaker 0 (53m 29s):

Shatner himself, has he ever given you any feedback

Speaker 2 (53m 34s):

not specifically. Yeah, but I know that he knows about the show. I know that fans have told them about it. And and and like I said, I’ve I do a lot of voice acting work. So I’ve been I’ve been at can many conventions with Bill as a signing guest. I would sign autographs based on a lot of the voice acting work that I’ve done and build might be three or four tables down signing autographs. Yeah, and you have the same event

manager. So consequently, we would get booked into a lot of events together. We’ve had dinners together. We’ve traveled together and Bill knows how much how much I love and respect and admire him. So I think he knows I had the chance to tell him that Star Trek Continues was literally A tribute to him and and the others that made the original series because I know Martin that there are hundreds of

thousands of people out there just like me who were so impacted by that show. They were so inspired and moved by that show Mark touched on it earlier people that went on to become engineers and teachers and scientists because of that show and those characters. All right, so I know that when we made Star Trek There were hundreds of thousands of people vicariously living through.

Speaker 4 (55m 4s):


Speaker 2 (55m 7s):

beyond that, you know show and be a part of that.

Speaker 0 (55m 10s):

Yeah, okay. We had a little bit of a Skype issue right then but that’s fine. It looks looks like it’s okay.

Speaker 4 (55m 16s):


Speaker 0 (55m 17s):

But yeah, so we I guess we can take it into break at this point. And this is a real break. We’ll be right back in just

Speaker 3 (55m 25s):

a few

Speaker 4 (55m 26s):


Speaker 3 (55m 38s):


Speaker 0 (55m 39s):

welcome back. This is Martin Willis. And I’m on with Mark Cushman and Vic mignogna. And I think I said that right or close. I’m trying maybe by the end of the end of the show

Speaker 4 (55m 51s):

of it by the

Speaker 2 (55m 52s):

time it’s over. You’ll have it down

Speaker 0 (55m 53s):

that’s right. Now

Speaker 4 (55m 55s):


Speaker 0 (55m 55s):

we’re coming back here, I’m I told Add the listening audience that we might touch on the subject of UFOs and there’s no wrong answer here for either one of you whatever you say. I just wondered have you ever thought about the subject of UFOs? Is that ever Intrigue? Either one of I don’t know which one wants to go

Speaker 2 (56m 14s):

first. I’m going to

Speaker 3 (56m 15s):

go for a walk. I’m gonna head back

Speaker 2 (56m 18s):

at first this time because it’ll be short. I’ve always been intrigued by the Martin and I’ll tell you a funny story when I was young when I was probably 12. 13 14 I made a little flying saucer and I suspended it from a fishing line and I went outside I went outside and I hung it held had a friend hold it in the air and I took pictures of it and it

looked and it was a forced perspective thing because the thing was only this big right?

Speaker 3 (56m 51s):


Speaker 2 (56m 52s):

but it was close to the camera, but it looked like it was hovering over the houses in my over

Speaker 0 (56m 57s):

Hood my God. Have you ever heard

Speaker 4 (56m 59s):

of Billy Meyer

Speaker 2 (57m 0s):

and I took pictures of it with a polaroid Land Camera and then I took those pictures to school and convinced half my school that I had

Speaker 5 (57m 10s):


Speaker 2 (57m 11s):

oh my god. Do you know what I made? Do you know what I made the UFO out of I made it out of a piece of the space station k-7 from the Star Trek episode The Trouble with Tribbles.

Speaker 4 (57m 26s):

Oh, that’s when the little little

Speaker 0 (57m 27s):

little thing little balls of

Speaker 2 (57m 29s):

fur. Come down a little the little saucer shaped and and I end and the pictures looked so real that everybody just they totally believed that I’d seen a UFO.

Speaker 4 (57m 41s):

I actually

Speaker 0 (57m 41s):

wanted to talk about The Trouble with Tribbles. I love that episode. But anyway, that’s pretty awesome. There’s a guy

Speaker 4 (57m 47s):

named Billy.

Speaker 0 (57m 48s):

Or I don’t know some people really believe in his work, but there’s been a lot of speculations about that type of thing fishing pole and to get some of the pictures he has. Well, you’re

Speaker 4 (58m 2s):

very creative

Speaker 2 (58m 3s):

nowadays the technology exists to allow you to you could fake just about anything but back when I did this it was like the mid 70s late 70s. So, you know, it was literally just hanging hanging a model of my thing wired taking a photo

Speaker 0 (58m 19s):

of it. Well, I’ll just before we move on to Mark before we move on to him. I just want to tell you a quick story. I just mentioned Billy Meier two of them and the Fine Arts and antiques and auctions and stuff like that for my real life and just recently at Sotheby’s to think two were for I maybe it’s four of his pictures sold his early 1960s pictures of flying saucers sold for over $20,000. We’re talking about


Speaker 2 (58m 49s):


Speaker 0 (58m 50s):

Did you save you a Polaroid?

Speaker 4 (58m 52s):

You know

Speaker 2 (58m 52s):

what I’ll bet.

Speaker 3 (58m 54s):

It’s in a

Speaker 2 (58m 54s):

drawer at my mother’s house somewhere right

Speaker 5 (58m 57s):


Speaker 0 (58m 59s):

That could be a funding for your next project. All right, Mark. What about you? Have you ever contemplated the topic of UFOs? Oh

Speaker 3 (59m 8s):

all the time. I I completely believe in it. I’ve seen a lot of specials movies and videos on it and so forth and there’s just so many things out there that are hard to explain almost impossible to explain and and and what I was on that dairy farm as a boy near Tillamook, Oregon, I I saw what I believed was a UFO and I can’t say if it was saucer-shaped or not because it was so much light coming out of it, but I could

really discern the exact shape but saucer round something but it just was immense light and no sound

Speaker 2 (59m 47s):


Speaker 3 (59m 48s):


Speaker 4 (59m 49s):


Speaker 3 (59m 50s):

we were surrounded by mountain ranges. I mean as I said earlier we couldn’t get Channel 8 out of out of Portland. This was a very back

Speaker 4 (59m 57s):

area, you know, where

Speaker 3 (59m 59s):

we had a hundred 60 acre dairy farm and Timberland and and I saw this thing for a couple minutes just hovering over

Speaker 4 (1h 0m 7s):

one of our

Speaker 3 (1h 0m 7s):

pastures and an out there by the way, you know, the sky is just filled with stars because there’s no City and and the climate up there in Oregon where I

Speaker 4 (1h 0m 18s):


Speaker 3 (1h 0m 18s):

up in so this thing was just a lumen ating it was incredible and yet it was so Eerie because there was no silence

Speaker 4 (1h 0m 26s):

and then it just went And what

Speaker 2 (1h 0m 28s):

off like

Speaker 3 (1h 0m 29s):

a streak and it was gone

Speaker 4 (1h 0m 31s):


Speaker 3 (1h 0m 32s):

this was when I was about

Speaker 4 (1h 0m 33s):

nine or ten.

Speaker 3 (1h 0m 34s):

So ever since then I’ve been into it and I’ve been read

Speaker 4 (1h 0m 37s):

about it

Speaker 3 (1h 0m 38s):

and watched it and listen to shows like yours Martin and so forth

Speaker 4 (1h 0m 41s):


Speaker 3 (1h 0m 42s):

and you know, when you look at we’re talking about Star Trek, you know, when Jean submitted the original proposal for the series to desilu and then to MBC the first page of 2 is just mathematical equations of the the Probability

Speaker 4 (1h 0m 60s):

of planets out there

Speaker 3 (1h 1m 2s):

that could have

Speaker 4 (1h 1m 3s):

life on

Speaker 3 (1h 1m 4s):

them. And if only one out of a billion supports life and if only one out of a billion of those has life that involves to intelligence, they would still

Speaker 4 (1h 1m 15s):


Speaker 3 (1h 1m 16s):

20 million billion planets that could have life making these numbers up but they’re like that. I mean the numbers are just immense in this proposal that he submitted.

Speaker 4 (1h 1m 27s):


Speaker 3 (1h 1m 28s):

they did a great UFO episode of Star Trek that Dorothy Fontana wrote tomorrow is yesterday where the Enterprise has thrown back in time? They were on their way to Earth and they they could probably tell us the reason why I was

Speaker 4 (1h 1m 43s):

talking about that the magnetic

Speaker 3 (1h 1m 44s):

pull of the Sun or something and it with them around and so they arrived at Earth but nobody’s responding to their hailing frequencies.

Speaker 4 (1h 1m 53s):

And then we

Speaker 3 (1h 1m 53s):

go down on Earth and we see we see the Jets being scrambled because the Prize has been spotted as a UFO and so they’ve ended

Speaker 4 (1h 2m 1s):

up in not

Speaker 3 (1h 2m 1s):

like 1967 Earth and the Jets are pursuing the Enterprise. It’s terrific

Speaker 4 (1h 2m 6s):

episode. They have to beam the pilot aboard

Speaker 3 (1h 2m 9s):

because the planes cracking up they put it in a tractor beam and it starts to break up. So they beam the

Speaker 4 (1h 2m 14s):


Speaker 3 (1h 2m 15s):

aboard the Enterprise and and he’s he’s confronted with this thing from 300 years in the future at a bokken and everything else. We have to figure out a way to get him back and Destroy any evidence. Has any of the film from his plane

Speaker 4 (1h 2m 31s):


Speaker 3 (1h 2m 31s):

got shots of the Enterprise and stuff like that. So they were all into it of course and you know, all the scripts of Star Trek went over

Speaker 4 (1h 2m 38s):


Speaker 3 (1h 2m 40s):

and the Rand Corporation and so forth and they got

Speaker 4 (1h 2m 43s):

they got feedback

Speaker 3 (1h 2m 43s):

on everything they did and Gene Roddenberry said look, I’m

Speaker 4 (1h 2m 46s):

not asking that

Speaker 3 (1h 2m 48s):

the stuff we do is probable

Speaker 4 (1h 2m 51s):

but I want to know that

Speaker 3 (1h 2m 52s):

everything we do in this show is possible and and so all that stuff went through. Did you see a lot of those memos and those notes in the books as well? So

Speaker 2 (1h 3m 2s):

that’s why

Speaker 3 (1h 3m 2s):

that show rang true where the other science fiction shows didn’t is because NASA was so into that show and they were so hooked on it. When they did Star Trek the motion picture NASA loan them the the made to voyagers one was a mock-up

Speaker 4 (1h 3m 16s):


Speaker 3 (1h 3m 16s):

the other one was the one they sent off into space

Speaker 4 (1h 3m 19s):

and in that episode,

Speaker 3 (1h 3m 21s):

they encountered Voyager returning to Earth.

Speaker 4 (1h 3m 23s):

These are hand

Speaker 3 (1h 3m 25s):

BJ which is v’ger in the movie because the some of the letters are rubbed out and

Speaker 4 (1h 3m 30s):


Speaker 3 (1h 3m 30s):

loan them the Voyager mock-up. So when you watch Star Trek the motion picture,

Speaker 4 (1h 3m 34s):

that’s the actual

Speaker 3 (1h 3m 35s):

mock-up for the Voyager space probe. So they were into

Speaker 4 (1h 3m 39s):

it. I’ve

Speaker 3 (1h 3m 40s):

got these real quick. I continued with a series of these books These Are the Voyages

Speaker 4 (1h 3m 45s):

and I’ve got a fourth one out now and

Speaker 3 (1h 3m 46s):

a fifth one coming out in a few months which take care of the 70s, which is the animated series The aborted Phase 2 Series and Star Trek the motion picture, but also the coming of Conventions and the growing of the fan base and everything that was happening

Speaker 4 (1h 4m 1s):


Speaker 3 (1h 4m 1s):

that decade and there was a part of it that just gives me chills will be in the fifth book. That’ll be out in the spring that Roddenberry was hired by

Speaker 4 (1h 4m 9s):

a group

Speaker 3 (1h 4m 10s):

out of New York called

Speaker 4 (1h 4m 12s):

the dine and they

Speaker 3 (1h 4m 15s):

put him with a Channeler who was speaking for aliens who had visited Earth and were preparing

Speaker 4 (1h 4m 20s):

to come back

Speaker 3 (1h 4m 21s):

and they were recruiting people like him to help prepare us for the return. And they wanted him to write a movie that would help prepare us and they felt Star Trek had done really good in that area as well. So the aliens were watching Star Trek, you know,

Speaker 4 (1h 4m 36s):

and and

Speaker 3 (1h 4m 38s):

and this the the I have the transcripts and I put a big chunk of that in the book and it’s the questions. He asks are just incredible and the answers that he’s getting from the Channeler are fascinating your may be aware of it of that research and everything Martin, but it was all new to me and I was had chills as I was going through this stuff.

Speaker 0 (1h 4m 57s):

Yeah, no never heard of it. Isn’t that amazing?

Speaker 4 (1h 5m 0s):


Speaker 3 (1h 5m 1s):

How about the book and you can read all about it.

Speaker 4 (1h 5m 3s):


Speaker 0 (1h 5m 4s):

Okay. Wow. Wow, that’s great. Now I’d like to shift gears a little bit and talk about the pop culture and the things that we’re going on. I mean right away. I noticed in the very first episode of Star Trek where there’s this blond lady that comes on board with his five o’clock report and right away. Kirk goes I’m just not used to a woman being here and and a woman was a second

officer on on board and but there was a lot of 1960s Overture that you know, kind of went right into that film and you talked about miniskirts and and but what do you think of the how that has evolved?

Speaker 4 (1h 5m 56s):

I mean you don’t really

Speaker 0 (1h 5m 57s):

carry it on.

Speaker 2 (1h 5m 59s):

I think that it it’s undeniable that Star Trek the Original Series of Star Trek pioneered new ground in a lot of areas whether it be scientific, which is Self-evident and then also in terms of like like like Mark even mentioned like race relations and

gender, you know male female roles and things like that. I think I think the the original series did a great deal to move the dial forward so to speak. indu in in presenting new ideas and breaking some stereotypes and molds of the time.

Speaker 3 (1h 6m 57s):


Speaker 4 (1h 6m 58s):

and and I cover

Speaker 3 (1h 6m 59s):

a lot of this in the books as well because I have to I what these books do is they take you back in time, you’re not reading about what happened back there you’re going back because when you see these memos all put together cut together sections and everything you feel like you’re sitting in a room listening to Stan Robertson from them. You see and Gene Roddenberry and jin-kun and Dorothy Fontana

Speaker 4 (1h 7m 23s):

and Bob Justman

Speaker 3 (1h 7m 24s):

all sitting around talking about this week’s episode that we’re about to produce and the script and everything else. So you’re you’re in the room you’re a fly on the wall watching the show being created and watching the show through its lifespan

Speaker 4 (1h 7m 38s):


Speaker 3 (1h 7m 40s):

and so part out of all that some of the things that I can share with you just quickly is in the first pilot, which you had noted Martin Starr Jeffrey Hunter

Speaker 4 (1h 7m 49s):

as Captain Pike.

Speaker 3 (1h 7m 51s):

First of all, they wanted

Speaker 4 (1h 7m 52s):

William Shatner,

Speaker 3 (1h 7m 53s):

but he was not available. He was the top

Speaker 4 (1h 7m 55s):

of the list and

Speaker 3 (1h 7m 58s):

they just knew he was the guy Roddenberry new Shatner was the guy but but Bill Shatner was doing for the people a TV series that he had on CBS and after they did the first pilot Jeffrey Hunter backed out because he was under contract to do five seasons

Speaker 4 (1h 8m 16s):

if the pilots

Speaker 3 (1h 8m 16s):

old but NBC rejected it and ordered a second pilot. And that was a loophole for him to get out because he was offered a movie role. So I’m going to go do that instead and right at that moment Bill Shatner series got canceled Roddenberry called Shatner and he flew out and he showed him the pilot and Shatner said, you know, he’s playing the character a little

Speaker 4 (1h 8m 37s):

too mellow

Speaker 3 (1h 8m 38s):

little too intellectually mellow and and I think I think a captain of this ship has to be a really ambitious guy to get to that position and he has to have that energy that you would follow him up into anything and so shatter brought it like Vic was saying Shatner really kind of co-created the character Kirk but the in the first pilot, but the second in charge of the Enterprise

Speaker 4 (1h 9m 3s):

was number one

Speaker 3 (1h 9m 4s):

who was

Speaker 4 (1h 9m 5s):

a female

Speaker 3 (1h 9m 7s):

but NBC felt

Speaker 4 (1h 9m 7s):

that that

Speaker 3 (1h 9m 9s):

maybe the audience won’t be ready for this. So they they made Spock second in charge. We couldn’t have a woman, but we could have

Speaker 4 (1h 9m 17s):

a Vulcan.

Speaker 2 (1h 9m 21s):

I remember something from your book that you wrote Mark in the book. You wrote how NBC basically called Roddenberry and they said you can have the pointed guy are guy or you can have the woman but you can’t have

Speaker 3 (1h 9m 36s):

both. Yeah.

Speaker 2 (1h 9m 42s):

Yeah, they said they said we’ll let you keep one of them but not both of them and Roddenberry now, and I know Mark was probably going to tell you this and I’m sorry for stealing your thunder mark But the number

Speaker 5 (1h 9m 53s):

one the

Speaker 2 (1h 9m 54s):

woman the woman from the original pilot was Gene. Roddenberry’s wife Majel Barrett and he in the book. It explains how Roddenberry felt so strongly about keeping the Spock character that he had to tell his wife that that her character was going to be gone.

Speaker 0 (1h 10m 13s):

Did they stay

Speaker 4 (1h 10m 14s):


Speaker 3 (1h 10m 16s):

Yes. They actually were not married at that point. She became jeans second. Yeah, she became his second wife, but she was his mistress at that

Speaker 4 (1h 10m 25s):

moment. Yes, and he said

Speaker 3 (1h 10m 28s):

I promise I’ll give you another row and he created the role of nurse Chapel for Her and she was also the voice of the Enterprise computer at the same time. So she had two roles in the series, but she didn’t get the role that he wrote for her in the pilot. Yeah, NBC was worried

Speaker 4 (1h 10m 42s):

about with

Speaker 3 (1h 10m 44s):

the if the audience would be accepting of the female second in charge who if they can’t captains in Jeopardy. She’s in charge of the ship. It was just a little ahead of the time there and they were all so worried about Spock’s character. He looked Housatonic and they didn’t think the the Bible Belt especially would go for that. Derp and so they kind of told Jane we’re not going to let you do both of these things. It’s just your challenge. You’re going to challenge the audience too much in two different ways. So you

Speaker 4 (1h 11m 13s):

got to pick and

Speaker 3 (1h 11m 15s):

he said well, I got to pick the Vulcan, you know, and and I’ll take my lumps at home. But but

Speaker 4 (1h 11m 23s):

but the

Speaker 3 (1h 11m 23s):

mini skirt Came

Speaker 4 (1h 11m 24s):


Speaker 3 (1h 11m 26s):

Grace Lee Whitney and Nichelle Nichols, they were supposed to be wearing slacks and they both were dancers. As they had great legs they want to show the legs off. So they said why can’t we be wearing skirts? And so they created the skirt outfit and they were the ones who kept raising the Hem saying, you know, it can’t be a little hired be more comfortable be more practical if it was higher and so that was America’s first look at the miniskirt. But

Speaker 4 (1h 11m 52s):

you know

Speaker 3 (1h 11m 53s):

to give your audience kind of a reference point

Speaker 4 (1h 11m 57s):


Speaker 3 (1h 11m 57s):

year earlier.

Speaker 4 (1h 11m 58s):

I spy

Speaker 3 (1h 11m 58s):

premiered and that was the first show that had and I did a book

Speaker 4 (1h 12m 1s):

about that

Speaker 3 (1h 12m 1s):

showed. That was the first show about a white and a black sharing equal billing in a TV show and a non stereotypical role for the black as well. And so the very next year Star Trek goes on with it either racial caste and and women at controls to in the future. And so we can look at it now and say it’s a little sexist or it’s not you know as politically correct as some people want everything to be now, but for 1966

when that show premiered it was pushing the barriers in every direction that you can imagine

Speaker 0 (1h 12m 38s):

that makes sense. I can see that yeah, you know when you really reflect on the whole thing in general what were some of the other kind of things that came out of Star Trek that you’re aware of either one

Speaker 3 (1h 12m 51s):

of you well, I’ll toss with you and they can tell you whatever I don’t mention what I forget but you the communicator is the This one because the guy who invented the community cell phone for Motorola based its design

Speaker 4 (1h 13m 10s):

and its

Speaker 3 (1h 13m 10s):

concept on Captain Kirk’s flip open Communicator.

Speaker 0 (1h 13m 15s):

Well, they all

Speaker 3 (1h 13m 15s):

carry the most Star Trek and

Speaker 4 (1h 13m 17s):


Speaker 3 (1h 13m 18s):

and Bill Gates and some of the other Wizards who came up with the internet and the PCS and everything, you know, they’ve made statements in the past about you know, they were kids watching Star Trek and thinking jeez if I could only

Speaker 4 (1h 13m 28s):


Speaker 3 (1h 13m 29s):

all the information of the world at my fingertips and why can’t I have with Spock has

Speaker 4 (1h 13m 35s):

another one the

Speaker 3 (1h 13m 37s):

minute I say this is going to pop into your head Martin and your audience as well is Bluetooth. I mean picture picture the bridge of the Enterprise you

Speaker 0 (1h 13m 44s):

harass got

Speaker 4 (1h 13m 45s):

that that Bluetooth

Speaker 3 (1h 13m 46s):

in her ear and Spock quite often has

Speaker 4 (1h 13m 48s):

one to make clothing

Speaker 0 (1h 13m 50s):

out of here.

Speaker 3 (1h 13m 50s):

We saw the first time we saw CDs DVDs was on Star Trek. The first time we saw MRIs. We’re

Speaker 4 (1h 13m 58s):

on Star Trek automatic opening

Speaker 3 (1h 14m 0s):

doors where you don’t

Speaker 4 (1h 14m 1s):

have to step on it. Not

Speaker 3 (1h 14m 2s):

like we had to in the 1960s, but they sensed you coming all this stuff came from Star Trek. It’s funny. I think most of our technology either comes from the military. Even the Frisbee came from the military either came

Speaker 4 (1h 14m 17s):

from the military

Speaker 3 (1h 14m 17s):

or came from Star Trek and and Star Trek

Speaker 4 (1h 14m 20s):

was not

Speaker 3 (1h 14m 20s):

copying the military. They were getting these ideas from guys from NASA. The military actually

Speaker 4 (1h 14m 25s):

came down

Speaker 3 (1h 14m 25s):

to desilu in 67 when Star Trek was finishing up his first season and and going into a second

Speaker 4 (1h 14m 33s):

and wanted

Speaker 3 (1h 14m 34s):

to take pictures of the bridge and examine the bridge and everything else because

Speaker 4 (1h 14m 39s):


Speaker 3 (1h 14m 39s):

thought that would be a great

Speaker 4 (1h 14m 40s):


Speaker 3 (1h 14m 41s):

for bridges on aircraft carriers and things of that nature. So they were coming to Star Trek to say we want to copy what you’re

Speaker 0 (1h 14m 48s):

doing. Is that amazing

Speaker 4 (1h 14m 51s):


Speaker 2 (1h 14m 52s):


Speaker 4 (1h 14m 52s):

did I forget?

Speaker 5 (1h 14m 53s):


Speaker 1 (1h 14m 55s):


Speaker 2 (1h 14m 55s):

the Bayou beds if you remember in the Sick Bay, there was a there was A little sensor that that stuck out of the wall above the bed and whenever somebody sat down laid down on the bed the the display would light up and it would give you all their vitals. Well, I remember reading an article just maybe a year ago that that technology has been developed now or is in development,

which is basically that same kind of a same kind of a bio read out of bed and And referencing Star Trek again the data tapes. That in Star Trek were just little square flat little square tapes. Well 20 years later. They were floppy disks. All right. So yeah, they were they were they were way ahead of their time and what

Speaker 0 (1h 15m 53s):

about you know, the warp speed warp drive. I mean you hear that used so often today that that didn’t you know, this is a real Layman speaking hear that term was never used before Star Trek or was it No,

Speaker 3 (1h 16m 9s):

I don’t believe so. They we saw it in a few movies like Forbidden

Speaker 4 (1h 16m 12s):


Speaker 3 (1h 16m 13s):

and some

Speaker 4 (1h 16m 13s):

books by

Speaker 3 (1h 16m 14s):

from Heinlein and whatever they and they would call it hyper drive

Speaker 4 (1h 16m 18s):


Speaker 3 (1h 16m 18s):

that’s what they called

Speaker 1 (1h 16m 19s):

Anna loss

Speaker 3 (1h 16m 20s):

of space to which premiered in 65 one year before Star Trek was hyperdrive

Speaker 4 (1h 16m 25s):


Speaker 3 (1h 16m 26s):

It’s funny again in these books. You see a lot of these memos from the scientists and so forth. I didn’t use a lot of that because my publisher was saying these books are too big. We got to Crunch them. Sound and so being a dramatic writer. I wanted to leave in the the memos from the creative staff and the fights with NBC and the stuff where you got conflict because conflicts the name of the game and anything you do. So a lot of the technical stuff

Speaker 4 (1h 16m 52s):

came out but but

Speaker 3 (1h 16m 55s):

I do have a lot of it in the the book will be out in the spring because for Star Trek the motion picture they had a fellow assigned to them from NASA who went through all the scripts like they did with the first series. He’s but he would send very detailed memos and they’re quite a few talking about warp drive and about

Speaker 2 (1h 17m 14s):

the Wormhole

Speaker 3 (1h 17m 15s):

and and everything else. And so they were they were getting all this from

Speaker 4 (1h 17m 19s):


Speaker 3 (1h 17m 20s):

And the reason we didn’t see that in other shows is because the other shows were didn’t have the support of NASA and JPL and and and the Rand Corporation and things like that Roddenberry made it a just made sure that all that the story outlines the scripts everything went to the People and they could get the feedback to make Star Trek as believable as possible.

Speaker 4 (1h 17m 43s):


Speaker 3 (1h 17m 43s):

judge it here and there like in space if with Enterprise flies by the camera and you hear it, whoosh.

Speaker 4 (1h 17m 48s):

Well, he

Speaker 3 (1h 17m 49s):

got a memo from one of them. They said, you know, there is no sound in space. You’re not going to hear a whoosh and he said yeah, but but it’s so much more dramatic. So we got to put that in there and but but most of the stuff they did the scientists looked at and said no 300 years from now.

Speaker 4 (1h 18m 6s):

We think that would absolutely

Speaker 3 (1h 18m 7s):

be A possible.

Speaker 0 (1h 18m 8s):

Yeah, right about the noise in space. It’s still used no matter what I mean, they still use it today and and any type of space, you know, and it always it always comes to mind when I see that you hear the noise like oh, yeah, you know you’d never hear that but yeah, but I get it America

Speaker 4 (1h 18m 27s):


Speaker 3 (1h 18m 27s):

I mean watch the you watch

Speaker 4 (1h 18m 29s):

the footage without that whoosh

Speaker 3 (1h 18m 30s):

sound and it just doesn’t quite have

Speaker 0 (1h 18m 31s):

the answer, right?

Speaker 2 (1h 18m 32s):

Yeah, you know, what’s kind of interesting Martin is that So many Sci-Fi TV shows and movies put sound effects of spaceships and and space battles in outer space. So many of them use sound that every once in a while a

Speaker 5 (1h 18m 49s):


Speaker 2 (1h 18m 51s):

will come along and it will not it will be it will be dead silent in space and it’s actually kind of creepy because we are so used to hearing spaceships fly by and so used to seeing lasers and Green laser beams firing in outer space that when a film comes along and goes, you know, what we’re going to go dead silent whenever we’re in outer space. It actually is is dramatic because we’re so used to the other way. Yeah

Speaker 4 (1h 19m 20s):


Speaker 3 (1h 19m 20s):

it’s traumatic surprising

Speaker 5 (1h 19m 22s):

and when

Speaker 4 (1h 19m 23s):

you were asking

Speaker 3 (1h 19m 24s):

me before about UFOs Martin

Speaker 4 (1h 19m 25s):

and I told you about that

Speaker 3 (1h 19m 27s):

thing in Oregon over the field. I mean, that was the thing

Speaker 4 (1h 19m 31s):


Speaker 3 (1h 19m 31s):


Speaker 4 (1h 19m 32s):

in my mind

Speaker 3 (1h 19m 32s):


Speaker 4 (1h 19m 33s):

more than the brightness.

Speaker 0 (1h 19m 34s):

I say that all the time. I’m about my sighting. I’ve talked about my sighting many times in the show. I won’t bore the listener, but that was the most dramatic thing for me as well was how can this thing be moving? And there’s absolutely no sound which is such a puzzle.

Speaker 2 (1h 19m 50s):

Yeah pretty amazing our night. I’d love to get the chance to talk about

Speaker 5 (1h 19m 53s):

the audiobook

Speaker 2 (1h 19m 54s):

a little bit if we could.

Speaker 0 (1h 19m 55s):

Yeah, let’s go. Let’s

Speaker 5 (1h 19m 56s):

do it.

Speaker 2 (1h 19m 58s):

This this audiobook is extraordinary as you know, if you I’m sure you listen to audio books before there. Usually one guy, right? There’s usually one narrator doing the whole book. But when I when I was getting ready to attack this monstrous project in the and as Mark mentioned the books are very very large very long. I thought well, you know, there are hundreds of people that speak in this book hundreds of people and and I didn’t want to have to do

all the different voices myself and the more I thought about it the more I thought wouldn’t it be really much more fun. Listen to If we brought other people in to be the voice of Gene Roddenberry and the voice of Dorothy Fontana and the voice of Leonard Nimoy and all of the people so that that you as the listener would feel like you’re actually sitting there listening to the actual people who

did it tell you in their own words, you know their own memos and their own stories we brought in. People from the original series who were still alive Dorothy Fontana came in and recorded her own excerpts Jody Augusta. The casting director came in Clint Howard Bobby Clarke people that were part of the original series came in and then if if the some of the people were passed like Leonard Nimoy had passed by this

point his son Adam came in and did his dad’s excerpts and Chris doing did his dad excerpts and then I brought in a lot of Star Trek Continues production crew and cast to be the voices of their counterparts. So like Jerry finnerman was the Director of Photography for Star Trek. Well, Jerry finnerman has passed away and like nobody probably knows what Jerry finnerman really sounded like anyway, because he wasn’t a an on-camera actor. So I

had Matt Busey our Director of Photography for Star Trek Continues be the voice of the Director of Photography for Star Trek. And the way the audiobook is has been produced. I’m the voice of the narrator. And the voice of mr. Shatner and the voice of a handful of small roles, but every time one of the major players whether it’s Oscar cats or herb Solo or or Alexander

courage or Bob Justman anytime they speak you hear a different person speaking and it makes you feel like you’re literally sitting in a room with the creators of Star Trek and they’re telling you their stories in first person. Even the people that read the

Speaker 1 (1h 22m 44s):

book absolutely.

Speaker 2 (1h 22m 52s):

Even though they’d read the printed book. They loved listening to the audiobook. It was like it was all new again.

Speaker 0 (1h 22m 58s):

Isn’t that something well, and that sounds like an editing nightmare to me call

Speaker 1 (1h 23m 3s):

it was

Speaker 2 (1h 23m 4s):

it was and you know what? I mean? I if I hit if I had done the book by myself, I probably could have read it and finished it in a couple of months at the most but having this lame-brained idea to bring in all of these other people like Told you early on in 88 0 Martin 80 different people are in this book for me. When I had that idea. I effectively quadrupled my workload.

Speaker 0 (1h 23m 32s):

Oh absolutely

Speaker 2 (1h 23m 34s):

here to to put it all together

Speaker 0 (1h 23m 37s):

year. I wonder if anyone’s ever put that kind of time in an audio book before

Speaker 4 (1h 23m 43s):

I don’t know,

Speaker 0 (1h 23m 43s):

but it’ll record

Speaker 2 (1h 23m 45s):

as with Star Trek as with Star Trek Continues. It went Way

Speaker 5 (1h 23m 49s):


Speaker 2 (1h 23m 50s):

most Money because you know for me it wasn’t about you know, how much money am I being paid for this it was about this is Star Trek. This is the thing that I loved since I was a little boy. This is the thing that I created a web series for what a privilege to be a part of of that of that series like this. So I spent the time and the effort willingly because of my love for the series

Speaker 4 (1h 24m 18s):

well, and

Speaker 3 (1h 24m 19s):

and we finally got him. Read the book

Speaker 1 (1h 24m 25s):

getting back

Speaker 3 (1h 24m 26s):

to the I could pick, you know you Vic. You’re always flying somewhere. Here’s a great

Speaker 4 (1h 24m 29s):

book to take on the plane. But when Vic is on a plane, he’s editing.

Speaker 3 (1h 24m 33s):


Speaker 4 (1h 24m 33s):

good stuff in it on his laptop.

Speaker 3 (1h 24m 36s):


Speaker 4 (1h 24m 36s):

he doesn’t have time to sit down

Speaker 3 (1h 24m 37s):

and read a 500-page book, which is

Speaker 2 (1h 24m 39s):

yeah. I said what he said Mark I’ll read the I listened to the audiobook and he said there is no audio book.

Speaker 4 (1h 24m 47s):

There’s no

Speaker 0 (1h 24m 48s):

wow. I do have a question. Russian for you Vic when you were creating this web series and had to have all this money involved. Are you allowed to make money to pay expenses and not to earn money on something like

Speaker 2 (1h 25m 6s):

that? The money that you raised can go for the hard expenses. For instance when we made the first episode Pilgrim of Eternity. I paid for the airfares. I paid to fly everybody to the studio and then you got to put them in hotels, right? So somebody’s got to pay for them the hotel people they may even be Star Trek fans, but they’re still going to charge you for the

Speaker 3 (1h 25m 33s):

rooms. Yeah,

Speaker 2 (1h 25m 34s):

and if you and everyone has to eat every day, so there are in there and then you have dolly dolly rentals and camera tripods and hard drives and makeup supplies and there are hard costs. Associated with putting something like this together. So you’re allowed to pay those but a singular a singular person like an actor or a or a or a makeup person or a

wardrobe person is not is not allowed to make a profit off of something like this and that is the real beauty of it. If you think about it, I have to

Speaker 4 (1h 26m 14s):

tell you thank God

Speaker 3 (1h 26m 15s):

he got professionals.

Speaker 4 (1h 26m 17s):

Yeah Hollywood professionals

Speaker 3 (1h 26m 19s):

to work on this show. Who were Fans like Doug Drexler who’s done the special

Speaker 2 (1h 26m 24s):


Speaker 3 (1h 26m 24s):

for next-generation a couple of other series a lot of the movies, he would do Enterprise, you know shots and things of that nature he came and did all the shots for the Enterprise on Star Trek Continues, which is why it looks so damn good

Speaker 2 (1h 26m 38s):

and you know what? You know what Martin I when I was I was living in La for a while and when I would tell people at Studios there what I was doing The first question out of their mouths was always well, how are you making

Speaker 0 (1h 26m 51s):


Speaker 2 (1h 26m 52s):

Yeah, and I would look at them. Like seriously. Is that really what your world

Speaker 3 (1h 26m 58s):


Speaker 2 (1h 26m 59s):

around does it does it is it such a foreign concept to you? It’s somebody would do something out of pure love and passion. You know, there are some things that are greater than money. And at some things that money can’t buy and one of the most beautiful things about Star Trek Continues and all these fan Productions is that people made them out of pure passion and love for the series not because they were going to make a million bucks or they were going to be

famous or they were going to bank a big paycheck. But because they really

Speaker 1 (1h 27m 34s):


Speaker 2 (1h 27m 34s):

the material and like Mark said we had professionals working on our series. And none of them were paid anything because they did it because they loved Star Trek and they wanted to be a part of it and that was extraordinary. That’s an incredibly

Speaker 0 (1h 27m 51s):

rare. That is I can’t think of any other situation where that would happen right off the bat

Speaker 2 (1h 27m 58s):

not usually now

Speaker 3 (1h 27m 60s):

what it was like when Vic asked me to do a script for the show and you know, it’s it wasn’t it was not a paying job,

Speaker 4 (1h 28m 7s):

but but I

Speaker 3 (1h 28m 8s):

had lots of other paint jobs I’ve written It’s and hundreds of scripts in my life and my career so, you know, I did a couple script assignments

Speaker 4 (1h 28m 16s):

and then I blocked

Speaker 3 (1h 28m 17s):

off two weeks instead of taking a vacation. I roped Divided We Stand

Speaker 4 (1h 28m 22s):

and and I had more fun writing

Speaker 3 (1h 28m 25s):

that script because I always wanted to write a script for the original series. Everybody had Next Generation wanted to write scripts for the original series everybody. There was a fan of the original series. It was difficult because by this point in his life Gene Roddenberry decided that if we are going to survive a hundred years. Beyond the original Star Trek man has to get rid of his Petty differences. And so there wasn’t very much conflict between the characters and the other Star Trek shows. And so all the writers down there were think

man. We wish we could be writing for Kirk Spock and McCoy and have

Speaker 4 (1h 28m 58s):


Speaker 3 (1h 28m 59s):

you know and teasing each other and doing things like that.

Speaker 4 (1h 29m 2s):

So when I got to right divided we

Speaker 3 (1h 29m 4s):

stand it was better than taking a vacation for me and by

Speaker 2 (1h 29m 9s):

the art and that is the fifth episode. So you’ll be coming up on that pretty soon and you remember that that Mark wrote that story but you know with no conflict. There’s no story in any book. You read any movie you watch any television show if you have no conflict, you have no story. So think about it if 300 or 400 years from now, everything is just hunky-dory and everybody just all gets along. There’s

what do you write about there? So there has to to be conflict in order for there to be a story. Well, yeah, that was a very interesting point that Mark

Speaker 4 (1h 29m 48s):

made I’m going to be

Speaker 3 (1h 29m 51s):

with the books to is I mentioned earlier I didn’t lay heavy on the scientific memos. I sprinkle them in so you can see that he had that support and NASA was really into it. There’s a great picture in the book to of all the people in NASA at their control stations for one of the Apollo flights and they’re all wearing Spock ears every

Speaker 4 (1h 30m 10s):

one of them.

Speaker 3 (1h 30m 12s):

They were fans,

Speaker 4 (1h 30m 13s):

but I knew

Speaker 3 (1h 30m 14s):

my screenwriting in steaks what I brought into. These books was this is a very dramatic Story how it got on the air how it stayed on the air the fights with the network everything else and the fights with production. How are we going to take this script and turn it into reality. How can we afford to do this?

Speaker 4 (1h 30m 30s):


Speaker 3 (1h 30m 31s):

unfortunately, they wrote Such colorful memos Bob Justman in particular and he could have been a stand-up comic his memos were so funny when they were trying to do the episode the Doomsday Machine which they did. do he didn’t want to do that

Speaker 4 (1h 30m 44s):

one and he wrote

Speaker 3 (1h 30m 45s):

memos to Jean Kuhn and Gene Roddenberry saying if you don’t cut this assignment

Speaker 4 (1h 30m 49s):

off, I’m

Speaker 3 (1h 30m 50s):

going to start sending you my psychiatrist bills and things like that because

Speaker 4 (1h 30m 54s):

he had

Speaker 3 (1h 30m 54s):

to take this script

Speaker 4 (1h 30m 56s):

and find

Speaker 3 (1h 30m 56s):

a way to realize

Speaker 4 (1h 30m 57s):

it and

Speaker 3 (1h 30m 58s):

and so the conflict with those characters in that show and the type of stories they were writing and the conflict

Speaker 4 (1h 31m 5s):


Speaker 3 (1h 31m 6s):

the scenes makes this an engaging read some people because of the size of the books will refer Them as reference books, which always offends me because they’re not they’re very dramatic read and so much so that when they came when they were published ICM, one of the bigger agencies in Hollywood contacted me you see if the screen rights were available because it had this this would make a good series a series about the making of series with all the drama that’s in there. Alright, fortunately you CPS is permission.

Speaker 4 (1h 31m 37s):

Well, I would

Speaker 0 (1h 31m 38s):

like to be able to take calls now if that’s If that’s possible, right, I do not have a call screener. We’re not live on the radio. So don’t have a call screener. So they be coming in live. So that number is up on the screen on YouTube 603 nine six seven 403. Oh now I’m going to ask you the dreaded question. You don’t want to be asked and I don’t want to hear they’re all like my babies to me. But anyway, I’m going to ask you what was your favorite episode of the first original series. I’m going to start

out when I was a kid. I loved things like getting Pigs and hamsters and stuff like that. So I loved the Trouble with Tribbles. I just remember as a kid, you know, I love that one. But there was so many more that we’re really interesting like the time travel one when they go back when Joan Collins is in it and all that but but I’m going to ask you the correct

Speaker 3 (1h 32m 32s):

directory puppy

Speaker 4 (1h 32m 32s):

about Trouble with Tribbles Martin.

Speaker 0 (1h 32m 35s):

Yeah. Go ahead

Speaker 3 (1h 32m 36s):

David Gerald

Speaker 4 (1h 32m 36s):

David Gerald

Speaker 3 (1h 32m 37s):

when I interviewed him for the book, you know, he told me that Every episode of Star Trek had a strong theme and the theme of that episode is overpopulation and he had had pet hamsters

Speaker 4 (1h 32m 48s):

and pet rats

Speaker 3 (1h 32m 50s):

and stuff when he was a kid, but you got to be careful not to put a male and a female in the same cage or you’re going to have

Speaker 0 (1h 32m 54s):

a lot of

Speaker 4 (1h 32m 55s):

little rats and so that got him the idea

Speaker 3 (1h 32m 57s):

of what would happen if these cute little critters that are harmless or seem harmless start breeding on the Enterprise and then it’s not harmless anymore. They’re eating up your food reserves there. They’re just causing a getting to the Hillary and so even

Speaker 4 (1h 33m 13s):

the most

Speaker 3 (1h 33m 13s):

benign creature

Speaker 4 (1h 33m 14s):

can be a problem.

Speaker 3 (1h 33m 15s):

If you don’t control population growth,

Speaker 0 (1h 33m 18s):

that’s where

Speaker 3 (1h 33m 19s):

you can handle it.

Speaker 0 (1h 33m 20s):

Yes. Also

Speaker 3 (1h 33m 21s):

Vic. Why don’t you tell him your faith?

Speaker 0 (1h 33m 23s):

Well before we get into that we do have a caller and I’m sorry again. I don’t have a scooter. So I have no way to to, you know, put these on hold for a long time caller. You’re on the line. What’s your name? Where you calling from? Your first name? Call are you still there? I think they may have dropped off. So if they call back in. Yeah, it shows that they’re some type of noise here at hung up for something. They’re trying again. So let’s give this another try. Sure. Welcome

to the show caller. Your first name, and where are you calling from? It did this last week to a New York number wouldn’t take the call. I was having trouble with Skype or should you use zoom and it may be just an issue it did this last week because I wasn’t on the radio show as well. So why don’t we go ahead into Vic what your who’s your favorite child? My

Speaker 2 (1h 34m 20s):

favorite. My favorite episode was a very obscure episode in the third season called Requiem from It was a it was about this. The Enterprise was there was an epidemic on the Enterprise and they needed this this substance to make

Speaker 5 (1h 34m 38s):

a an antidote

Speaker 2 (1h 34m 40s):

for it and they go to this planet and there’s this older gentleman living alone

Speaker 5 (1h 34m 44s):

on the planet and they

Speaker 2 (1h 34m 48s):

beam down and they meet this man

Speaker 5 (1h 34m 49s):

and then

Speaker 2 (1h 34m 49s):

they find out that he has his daughter and Kirk of course falls in love with the daughter and and then you Find out over the course of time that this older man is in fact, all of these famous men throughout history. He’s Immortal and he was he was Moses and Socrates and DaVinci and Brahms and throughout history. And

what what I loved the most about that episode. Was that at the very end of the episode you see Captain Kirk as you’ve never seen him in the whole rest of the series and that was ashamed of his behavior. Well, you see Captain Kirk literally embarrassed about the way

Speaker 5 (1h 35m 40s):

he behaved and

Speaker 3 (1h 35m 42s):

brought. Yeah

Speaker 2 (1h 35m 43s):

as a little kid. I remember thinking oh my gosh. He’s a normal flawed flesh-and-blood human just like we are he’s not the perfect hero who always does the right thing and always has the answer

Speaker 3 (1h 35m 60s):

he screwed

Speaker 2 (1h 36m 1s):

up and he knows it and he and he really regrets it and and that that really impacted me so much. So Martin that our fourth episode which you’re going to be watching soon. I hope discusses that Very same thing. It shows a side of Kirk that that has a lot of regrets and shame

Speaker 5 (1h 36m 28s):

and unfinished

Speaker 2 (1h 36m 33s):

business with people from his past

Speaker 5 (1h 36m 37s):

and and

Speaker 2 (1h 36m 38s):

it was the impetus for episode 4. Was that final scene in Requiem for Methuselah for me? That’s that’s my favorite episode and that’s why

Speaker 0 (1h 36m 47s):

well before we get into yours, thank you for that. That’s really I don’t recall that in particular sounds familiar, but I just don’t recall that but for someone that kind of displays a huge So as Kirk seems to that that I can understand why that would make an impact. We are having an issue with Skype. We had several people trying to call in and it would not join any of them. So we’re going to skip the phone calls tonight. I’m sorry to say and I don’t do appreciate those

people who have tried to call in. I really do appreciate you trying we’ll be back to our radio station with this call screener next week. So go ahead

Speaker 3 (1h 37m 26s):

Mark. My favorite and there’s so many I journey to babbo is a great episode Doomsday Machine Shore leave for real fans of the show. They know the titles, but my favorite is this side of paradise which Dorothy Fontana wrote and in that episode they beam down to a planet they came to rescue if anybody’s alive these settlers, but they’re not expecting anybody to be alive

because they found out there’s a certain radiation. shouldn’t that’s been hitting the planet and they’re surprised to find the people are still there and healthy and happy but the reason they are is because there’s these spores that have taken over their bodies

Speaker 4 (1h 38m 9s):

not taking over their minds

Speaker 3 (1h 38m 10s):

but taking over their body so that they are protected from the radiation and it gives the spores a body to live in well when the spores hits you your anxiety goes away your troubles go away and you become it was kind of like a

Speaker 4 (1h 38m 24s):


Speaker 3 (1h 38m 24s):

on drugs from that era and and and Spock get shot by the spores and he falls in love with July Ireland and

Speaker 4 (1h 38m 34s):

and the

Speaker 3 (1h 38m 34s):

entire crew abandons the ship and Kirk is left all alone on the ship. He’s been shot by the spores to but he doesn’t give in to them because he’s such a driven man. He is imperfect. He’s swaggering commanding driven ambitious in every way possible and so he fights off the spores and they can’t get an

Speaker 4 (1h 38m 54s):

edge on him, but

Speaker 3 (1h 38m 55s):

he’s got to get his crew back and the Person, he needs the most to spock and he’s the only one left on the ship who can beam spot back. So he figures he’s got to find a way to get Spock angry so that he can get rid of the spores through anger, which is the thing that kept Kirk from from being subjected to them. And and so he does it and there’s a fight in transporter room and everything else. But at the end of the episode is so poignant because Spock looks sad

Speaker 4 (1h 39m 25s):

and and Kirk

Speaker 3 (1h 39m 26s):

looks at him and says, you know, are you okay? Okay, and he says captain for the first time in my life. I was happy.

Speaker 4 (1h 39m 32s):

Wow. Oh

Speaker 3 (1h 39m 33s):

Jesus. I mean I just got a little crack on my voice when I try to say the line because it’s so

Speaker 4 (1h 39m 38s):


Speaker 3 (1h 39m 39s):

It’s a great Kirk story losing his entire crew and he says I never realized how big this ship was. He’s recording to Captain’s Log and he’s all alone on his ship. It’s a great story for Spock because he falls in love and for the first time in his life, he was happy and he lost it and and so forth It’s just these are the Stories, they told on that show that that I’ve never seen on any other TV shows science fiction or anything else and that’s what hooked me on this

Speaker 0 (1h 40m 6s):

series. I do remember that. I do remember that particular one. How do you think the show itself when it was in production and you know became semi popular a popular you were saying that it was actually popular during the you know, when it was being the first out the First run, but how did it affect the people’s lives the actors lives as far as everyday life did that did you ever


Speaker 3 (1h 40m 36s):

any of that automatically you oh sure sure because I interviewed them and but also I had the memos and even they were writing memos Nimoy would write a lot of letters to run a berry about episodes. They were getting ready to film and things of that nature and

Speaker 4 (1h 40m 53s):


Speaker 3 (1h 40m 54s):

you know, it had an audience of between 15

Speaker 4 (1h 40m 56s):

to 20 million

Speaker 3 (1h 40m 56s):

people a week on

Speaker 0 (1h 40m 57s):

Be seizing

Speaker 3 (1h 40m 59s):

the first episode that aired on the network had a rating of audience share of 47.5% 47.5% of the TVs in America were watching Star Trek that night. Does that sound like a failure? You know that they did all do that well, but but but quite often as I said to be winning his time slot, so they had like 20 million people a week watching that thing it became even more popular in the 70s running five nights a week in every city across America. We’re was beating Networks. Shows and so forth and also in the new

book you read about Embassy trying to get it back two years after they canceled it and Paramount

Speaker 4 (1h 41m 34s):

will give

Speaker 3 (1h 41m 35s):

it back to them because they’ve destroyed all the sets. They given the Enterprise to the Smithsonian Institute the

Speaker 4 (1h 41m 40s):

12-foot model

Speaker 3 (1h 41m 42s):

and they’re thinking, you know, if you don’t give us a two-year commitment, we’re not going to rebuild all this stuff and that was what was keeping it off TV in the 1970s, which what none of us knew about

Speaker 4 (1h 41m 53s):


Speaker 3 (1h 41m 55s):

Nimoy was the most affected because He had

Speaker 4 (1h 41m 58s):

and everybody

Speaker 3 (1h 41m 59s):

told me this and Vic. You got a story. You got to tell I’ll be done in a second and I’ll throw it over to you if we have time, but but

Speaker 4 (1h 42m 7s):

Nimoy had

Speaker 3 (1h 42m 8s):

to play this character who was blocking his emotions and every actor. I interviewed all the guest stars. Everybody would come through the show would say the same thing that he would be so friendly and everything, but in make up the minute they started

Speaker 4 (1h 42m 22s):

putting the makeup on

Speaker 3 (1h 42m 24s):

he just became

Speaker 4 (1h 42m 24s):

Spock and

Speaker 3 (1h 42m 26s):

you could not get him

Speaker 4 (1h 42m 27s):

to smile.

Speaker 3 (1h 42m 27s):

Allure laughs they were always trying and there are few pictures in my books and a few that you might find on the internet where you see Spock with a big grin on his face because Shatner in particular was always trying to get Nimoy to it’s a laugh always trying to crack him up, but he became that character and after the show was over the first series he wrote a book

Speaker 4 (1h 42m 47s):

called. I am not Spock

Speaker 3 (1h 42m 48s):

which is not

Speaker 4 (1h 42m 49s):

a put-down. I’m sure at all like

Speaker 0 (1h 42m 51s):

the title – you think

Speaker 3 (1h 42m 52s):

he’s talking about what he learned from that character and for the Of his life and he told me this as well for the rest of his life. He would have conversations with himself if he was ever wondering what should I do? He would he would it without speaking in his mind. He would say Spock. What do you think? I should do here? I like that was Spock would say well let it will Leonard. I think you should do this. So it became another side of his personality which he kept in to him for the rest of his life and utilized for the rest of his life.

But Vic, you got to tell the story about you know, you hear George a

Speaker 4 (1h 43m 27s):

always taking shots at Shatner and stuff like that and after

Speaker 3 (1h 43m 31s):

evicted the audiobook and so which got him to read the book and he saw all these interviews I did with all these guest actors and every and even the regular cast and even Takei back then what he had to say and so forth Fick share that story with what you told William

Speaker 5 (1h 43m 46s):

Shatner. Yeah, I

Speaker 2 (1h 43m 50s):

as I was reading the book, I was really struck by how just everybody Martin Everybody. In the book talked about how extraordinary Shatner was they talked about. What a great actor that he was they talked about how affable he was that when they were on set. He was just he was so full of energy and he would crack people up and making jokes and make you feel so at home and then the cameras would roll and he would be right there with Captain Kirk,

but he would come up with ideas and he would bounce

Speaker 5 (1h 44m 23s):


Speaker 2 (1h 44m 23s):

and and and demonstrate ideas even Our guest stars talk about ensure leave when he fought the the character Finnegan who was a friend of his from his Academy days Mark interviewed the actor who played

Speaker 5 (1h 44m 41s):


Speaker 2 (1h 44m 42s):

and he talked about how Shatner and he choreographed this fight and Shatner who’s the star of the show? And this guy this other guy is just an episodic actor a day player and shatter choreographed certain fight moves so that the other guy would get more screen time and there were so many stories where everybody that that talked about Shatner talked about what a consummate professionally was and how great he was

and funny and energetic and supportive. So about a year and a half ago. I was signing autographs at a convention Florida Super Con

Speaker 5 (1h 45m 23s):


Speaker 2 (1h 45m 24s):

and I was in The Green Room and bill came in. He was signing that weekend as well Bill and Gary are manager came in and the two of them sat down at a table and

Speaker 5 (1h 45m 34s):

I walked

Speaker 2 (1h 45m 34s):

over and I sat down beside bill and I put my arm on his shoulder and I said, I’d like to tell you a story that I think will really encourage you and Bill looked at me and said do I look like

Speaker 5 (1h 45m 48s):

I need encouragement then

Speaker 4 (1h 45m 50s):

tried like something he’d say

Speaker 2 (1h 45m 52s):

and I said no and I said no. No, but I said he said I’m just kidding and I said let me tell you I’m reading this audiobook and I said I want

Speaker 5 (1h 46m 1s):

you to know that

Speaker 2 (1h 46m 2s):

everybody that was interviewed for this book. The guest stars crew people other actors production people all talked about how amazing you were how kind how funny how supportive how energetic how brilliant you were and I said so now in today’s in today’s period where there are people kind of

rewriting stories, you know what I mean and taking shots it

Speaker 5 (1h 46m 36s):

at him and

Speaker 2 (1h 46m 37s):

and there’s some some conflict and rivalry between some of the actors I said, I just want you to know I just thought that would encourage you Bill to know that the dozens and dozens. Dozens of people that I that I read about who worked with you in this series all had nothing but the most glowing things to say about you and he turned to me and he put his arm on my shoulder and he said that does encourage me Vic. Thank you. Thank you for telling me that he said, you know after all is a lot of the things that have

been said over the years that really means a lot to

Speaker 0 (1h 47m 9s):

me. Wow,

Speaker 2 (1h 47m 11s):

isn’t that it was it was it was really a great privilege to be able to tell him and again, this is

Speaker 5 (1h 47m 18s):

A man who created, you know

Speaker 2 (1h 47m 20s):

a father figure in a role model for me when I was young and to be able to tell him what an impact he had on all of the people around him that he worked with the other actors in the production people. It was a real privilege to share that

Speaker 5 (1h 47m 34s):

with him.

Speaker 0 (1h 47m 35s):

That’s amazing. Now. I know Leonard Nimoy

Speaker 4 (1h 47m 39s):


Speaker 0 (1h 47m 40s):

one of the series episodes he had a virus or something and then became like Human was crying and and they can all of a sudden his fan in his fan mail increased like 10 times or something like that. Yeah, people saw him as

Speaker 2 (1h 47m 59s):

the naked time.

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 0s):

Yeah, of course that’s in the book as well because every episode

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 3s):

is a chapter and that’s an

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 4s):

episode called The Naked time is Victor said which was written by my friend John.

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 8s):

Do you have black

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 9s):

we just lost this last year

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 12s):

and he the week after that aired

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 17s):

and that was the Fourth episode they aired of the series it was shot. It was maybe the six

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 22s):

or seven shop at it,

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 23s):

but the others weren’t ready to put on because special effects were delaying

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 26s):

them and

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 28s):

the network was nervous about putting that on as the fourth episode because in the story everybody gets his virus

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 35s):

and it

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 37s):

makes me it makes

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 38s):

them become uninhibited.

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 40s):

So sue

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 41s):

is running around the Enterprise

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 42s):

with the saber because they always kind of thought himself is a

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 45s):

swashbuckler chasing

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 46s):


Speaker 4 (1h 48m 48s):

And and

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 49s):

people are just

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 49s):

you know, kind

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 50s):

of it’s a part of their character

Speaker 4 (1h 48m 52s):

but they’re not holding

Speaker 3 (1h 48m 54s):

it in and spot gets affected by it and he realizes he’s been affected but as a Vulcan, he doesn’t want anybody to see him

Speaker 4 (1h 49m 3s):

not be unemotional

Speaker 3 (1h 49m 5s):

and so he goes into the briefing room by himself and he sits down in a chair and he just starts sobbing and Kirk comes in finds him and he just looks up the Kirk. He says my mother I was never able to tell her that I loved her.

Speaker 4 (1h 49m 18s):


Speaker 3 (1h 49m 18s):

know and very strong again. The material was just amazing.

Speaker 2 (1h 49m 22s):


Speaker 4 (1h 49m 22s):


Speaker 3 (1h 49m 23s):

the very next week thousands

Speaker 4 (1h 49m 24s):

and thousands

Speaker 3 (1h 49m 25s):

of letters were pouring in that this character that NBC was so worried about

Speaker 4 (1h 49m 30s):

but America would not

Speaker 3 (1h 49m 31s):

take two people fell in love with this character and then the mammals you see them

Speaker 4 (1h 49m 36s):

in the book cart

Speaker 3 (1h 49m 36s):

start coming from NBC and their start saying, hey, let’s give

Speaker 2 (1h 49m 39s):

Spock more stuff to

Speaker 4 (1h 49m 40s):

do. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (1h 49m 43s):

He’s getting more. He’s getting more mail

Speaker 4 (1h 49m 45s):

than the monkeys Star Trek. Star Trek

Speaker 3 (1h 49m 48s):

and Leonard Nimoy, we’re getting more mail more family dinners were coming in boxes and boxes and bags and bags than even the monkeys were getting which were on NBC

Speaker 4 (1h 49m 58s):

at that time.

Speaker 3 (1h 49m 59s):

So start service getting more mail than any other show on television. Wow,

Speaker 0 (1h 50m 4s):

wasn’t that amazing? I had no idea of that part of it. And as far as typecasting, you know, you think of Leonard Nimoy he didn’t do a lot after that. He did, you know, there were certain things. He was in all ways. Great, very fine actor Kirk Bill Shatner seem to handle that. Well, I’m going on two different things. But do you think a lot of people were typecasted and had nowhere to go after? Yeah track.

Speaker 3 (1h 50m 32s):

Oh they they all told me that Jimmy Doohan Walter cane egg. Who’s a friend of mine as well.

Speaker 0 (1h 50m 37s):

He just tell

Speaker 3 (1h 50m 38s):


Speaker 0 (1h 50m 38s):

for scuse me. I’m sorry. Can you I didn’t mean to interrupt you bake until the actor’s name, but who they played in the

Speaker 3 (1h 50m 45s):

oh sure. Sure

Speaker 0 (1h 50m 46s):


Speaker 3 (1h 50m 47s):

Well Jimmy Doohan was Scotty and Walter Koenig. It was check off and Walter just wrote the foreword for my new book coming out Dorothy Fontana wrote the foreword for the last one. She’d been reading them all as you want to write the forward the sure but but Walter, you know, and so Jim Doohan and Walter Koenig, especially because both of them had done a lot of work on television before Star Trek, especially Jimmy Doohan who was a little older and been

Speaker 4 (1h 51m 16s):

in more

Speaker 3 (1h 51m 17s):

than a hundred guest spots on different shows. Wow, and he was Canadian, but he was great with dialects. And so when Gene Roddenberry hired him for Star Trek, he said I want you to play the engineer. I’d like you to have an accent. What do you want to have and it was Jimmy Doohan who said

Speaker 4 (1h 51m 32s):

I think

Speaker 3 (1h 51m 32s):

you know, he should be Scottish because the Scots are always great with engines and machines and things and and all that. Well when Star Trek went off, he suddenly not getting hired. He’d be doing a dozen guest spots a year before Star Trek and now suddenly he’s doing one or Year because people would think oh, we can’t hire him. He’s Scottish. We don’t need this character have a Scottish

Speaker 4 (1h 51m 55s):


Speaker 3 (1h 51m 56s):

And and so as same thing happened to Walter, he was really coming alive as an actor on television doing a lot of guest stars young good-looking boy and and everything and then he gets on Star

Speaker 4 (1h 52m 5s):


Speaker 3 (1h 52m 6s):

and and they have them do the

Speaker 4 (1h 52m 8s):

Russian the

Speaker 0 (1h 52m 8s):

Russian accent

Speaker 3 (1h 52m 9s):

errands for his parents were Russian immigrants. So he was able to do that accent very well because that’s the way they sounded When he was growing up to him and

Speaker 4 (1h 52m 21s):


Speaker 3 (1h 52m 21s):

after Star Trek, it’s like what we don’t need a Russian. So we’re not going to hire him. So that really hurt them in particular Shatner because he was so successful before Star Trek had had a series had been a top TV guest star. He bounced right back right because they knew

Speaker 4 (1h 52m 39s):

he could play

Speaker 3 (1h 52m 40s):

anything. Yeah Nimoy was Typecast as Spock and he had done a lot of work for Star Trek before star. To and was a tremendous actor, but he wasn’t getting offered the roles that he wanted. So he did two years on mission impossible. So he could play a Master of Disguise and that is dialects to try to show

Speaker 4 (1h 52m 59s):


Speaker 3 (1h 52m 59s):

after that he started doing more stage

Speaker 4 (1h 53m 1s):

and I mean Broadway

Speaker 3 (1h 53m 2s):

big stage because he said I just don’t like the rows that are being offered to me. So he chose to do less television and film after mission possible and he kind of went to do the stage work where he could do Fiddler on the Roof and be singing and playing the lead and things of that nature

Speaker 4 (1h 53m 19s):

and Sherlock Holmes

Speaker 3 (1h 53m 20s):

and stuff like that on Broadway. So that was an artistic choice of his.

Speaker 0 (1h 53m 25s):

Wow. I didn’t realize he had a singing voice. That’s amazing.

Speaker 3 (1h 53m 30s):

Oh, well, you just records back in the 60s. Mr. Spock’s music from outer space.

Speaker 4 (1h 53m 36s):

Thank God. How about

Speaker 0 (1h 53m 38s):

that? I remember will bail Shatner from Twilight Zone many up several episodes. He was in that way. Yeah. Yeah,

Speaker 4 (1h 53m 47s):


Speaker 3 (1h 53m 48s):

Bill Shatner was in a lot of movies Judgment at Nuremberg and he was one of the prosecutors in the movie. He had a series for the people. He was in the pilot for the Defenders and they wanted him to play the son of EJ Marshall, but he turned it down. So they hired Robert Reed but shatter was like the guy everybody was trying to get into a series

Speaker 0 (1h 54m 7s):

I said

Speaker 4 (1h 54m 8s):

that’s why

Speaker 3 (1h 54m 9s):

he was one of the first ones that Roddenberry thought of so he was Shatner.

Speaker 4 (1h 54m 15s):

Jack Lord and Robert Cooper

Speaker 3 (1h 54m 17s):

like the three go to guys that everybody was trying to get for a series and

Speaker 4 (1h 54m 20s):

they even

Speaker 3 (1h 54m 21s):

offered Captain Kirk to Jack Lord when shatter wasn’t available before they got Jeffrey Hunter they went to Jack Lord and said, will you play this? Can you imagine?

Speaker 4 (1h 54m 33s):

Yeah suck that. Yeah you

Speaker 3 (1h 54m 35s):

wanted to he wanted to bit too much. He said you

Speaker 4 (1h 54m 37s):

wanted a piece of the action shouting got

Speaker 3 (1h 54m 39s):


Speaker 4 (1h 54m 40s):

of the show,

Speaker 3 (1h 54m 41s):

Jack Lord wanted something like 10 or 15 percent so they turned him down. And then he was hired to do wife Idol which turned out a pretty good show

Speaker 4 (1h 54m 48s):

and he owned a chunk of that. Yeah,

Speaker 5 (1h 54m 50s):

you know,

Speaker 2 (1h 54m 51s):

you know, you know Martin people sometimes make fun of Shatner as they say over acting but you know back in that day he was he was heralded

Speaker 5 (1h 55m 4s):


Speaker 2 (1h 55m 5s):

as an incredible actor. I mean, he was a Shakespearean trained

Speaker 5 (1h 55m 10s):

actor and

Speaker 2 (1h 55m 12s):

and he was he was very very very Highly respected

Speaker 5 (1h 55m 18s):

as an actor and

Speaker 2 (1h 55m 20s):

I always

Speaker 5 (1h 55m 21s):

find it funny

Speaker 2 (1h 55m 21s):

when you know people nowadays want to you know, take potshots but man he was it was really something for for them to get him for Star Trek because he was highly respected for his abilities.

Speaker 5 (1h 55m 35s):

Right and

Speaker 3 (1h 55m 35s):

what you think

Speaker 4 (1h 55m 36s):

you see that in the books to

Speaker 3 (1h 55m 37s):

they were very excited when they when they got him because they wanted him to begin with and so when his show

Speaker 4 (1h 55m 42s):

got canceled

Speaker 3 (1h 55m 43s):

and he would they were able to bring them in? And he told Gene Gene called him. He said chatter sighs. I love science fiction.

Speaker 4 (1h 55m 48s):

Yeah, I’ve done a couple Twilight zones. I’ve

Speaker 3 (1h 55m 50s):

done Thriller. I’ve done all these things. I love science fiction. He came saw the pilot and he said sign me up.

Speaker 0 (1h 55m 57s):

I’m your captain X and

Speaker 4 (1h 55m 58s):


Speaker 3 (1h 55m 58s):

the memos in the book or just great because like Bob Jessup has

Speaker 1 (1h 56m 1s):

gone. We got Bill Shatner.

Speaker 0 (1h 56m 5s):

Well, we are out of time. So I’d like for one at a time. We’ll start with you Mark. If you would just give out all your information so people can connect with You know to get to the book and all that.

Speaker 3 (1h 56m 19s):

You betcha.

Speaker 4 (1h 56m 20s):


Speaker 3 (1h 56m 20s):

by Publishers for these books is called Jacobs from Media Group and they got their website Jacobs from media, but that’s a hard thing to remember. So they also

Speaker 4 (1h 56m 29s):


Speaker 3 (1h 56m 30s):

a link to it These Are the Voyages

Speaker 4 (1h 56m 34s):

and you can go

Speaker 3 (1h 56m 34s):

there and you can read about the books. You can read excerpts from the books. You can hear excerpts from the audiobook

Speaker 4 (1h 56m 40s):

all that kind of

Speaker 3 (1h 56m 40s):

stuff course.

Speaker 4 (1h 56m 41s):

The books are available on Amazon and Barnes

Speaker 3 (1h 56m 44s):

& Noble and so forth. But the nice thing about going to These Are the Voyages is if you get the book,

Speaker 4 (1h 56m 49s):

Look, it comes

Speaker 3 (1h 56m 50s):

signed. You can even get it inscribed. I do them every day. They send me things and say sign this book this

Speaker 4 (1h 56m 55s):

way and the whole bit and

Speaker 3 (1h 56m 57s):

and the audiobook is

Speaker 4 (1h 56m 59s):

there and

Speaker 3 (1h 56m 60s):

it’s also

Speaker 4 (1h 57m 0s):

on a service called all sound ink

Speaker 3 (1h 57m 3s):

aw ESO UND ink you won’t find

Speaker 4 (1h 57m 8s):

the audio book on

Speaker 3 (1h 57m 9s):

Amazon. Actually, you will find

Speaker 4 (1h 57m 11s):


Speaker 3 (1h 57m 13s):

set of the audiobook. But if you want it as a download to plan your mobile device as you’re taking

Speaker 4 (1h 57m 17s):

a drive across America

Speaker 3 (1h 57m 18s):

and you

Speaker 4 (1h 57m 19s):

need it. Twenty-eight our audio book you can you can

Speaker 3 (1h 57m 23s):

download it to your mobile device from these are the boys is or all sound

Speaker 0 (1h 57m 29s):

All right. Well, I will have the all these links in the show notes at podcast also on YouTube and we are just about out of time. So if you could quickly

Speaker 4 (1h 57m 41s):

pick, yes,

Speaker 2 (1h 57m 42s):

first of all, thank you so much for having

Speaker 5 (1h 57m 44s):


Speaker 2 (1h 57m 45s):

as Mark said the audio book is available. Please check it out. You will. Of it. I want to give a shout out to Chelsea because not only is she amazing

Speaker 5 (1h 57m 53s):


Speaker 2 (1h 57m 54s):

wonderful, but she helped organize all of those actors and helped me figure out who spoke in what chapters

Speaker 5 (1h 58m 2s):

so that I know

Speaker 2 (1h 58m 3s):

it was an enormous undertaking and she’s amazing, but you can check out Star Trek the website all of our episodes are there free to watch all of it back behind the scenes videos making of videos interviews. Use and all the episodes all free. It’s all for the love of Star Trek. I do a lot of event appearances around the country if there any comic cons near you and you happen to see my

Speaker 5 (1h 58m 29s):

name on the on

Speaker 2 (1h 58m 30s):

the roster come and say hello neutral zone is the studi is the website where

Speaker 5 (1h 58m 37s):

you can find out

Speaker 2 (1h 58m 38s):

information about touring our sets for that we build and available.

Speaker 0 (1h 58m 43s):

I mean check that out myself.

Speaker 2 (1h 58m 45s):

Yeah, like a saint like us on Facebook and now we’ll hope to see all of You at the studio?

Speaker 0 (1h 58m 50s):

Excellent. Thank you. Both so much has been a lot of fun for me a really great way to wrap up the year. Yeah. Thank

Speaker 5 (1h 58m 56s):

you. Thank you, Martin.

Speaker 0 (1h 58m 57s):

All right. Have a good night for New Year. Happy New Year. Alright everyone. So that is it for the show. Thanks so much for listening and we’ll be back

Speaker 4 (1h 59m 6s):


Speaker 0 (1h 59m 6s):

week with we have David O’Leary. He’s the executive producer for Project Blue Book as well as Sean jablonski. They’re both going to be on and then Ted row and the second hour so we’ll be back at the regular time on kgr a radio as well as YouTube as usual and I want to thank everyone that helps out with show. I want to give a special thanks to Michelle as well for helping out with our guest tonight

and again, very enjoyable and we’ll see you next week and remember to keep your eyes to the sky.

Copyright ©2019 Podscribe Inc.

Show 384 Notes: William Grabowski

YouTube Live Streamed Tuesday, December 23rd @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-5)

Guest William Grabowski joins us to talk about his book BLACK LIGHT: Perspectives on Mysterious Phenomena and much more.

WILLIAM GRABOWSKI is the author of nine books: 10,000 Miles to Go: An American Filmmaking Odyssey (with NYC Underground Film Festival Award-winner Jason Rosette); Infinity Point; media tie-in Castro’s Cadillac (optioned for film in 2016 by CuffLink Productions); The Black Edge series; Traces of Oblivion; Amazon #1 Bestseller Black Light: Perspectives on Mysterious Phenomena; Johnny Flash; The Untold; Flowers on the Moon and over 500 short stories, articles, essays, interviews and reviews.

Five years as contributing editor with World Fantasy Award-winning The Horror Show magazine earned him a nomination from SPWAO as Best Nonfiction Writer. Recent articles have appeared in online editions of Forbes, Philadelphia Business Journal, Joseph Mackin’s (original internet editor for The Paris Review) 2 Paragraphs-dot-com; in print magazines Fortean Times, Cemetery Dance, NPR-associated Wireless and elsewhere.

Grabowski has been quoted by NBC2 News, is a contributing editor covering social science with New York City’s iconic Library Journal magazine, and a staff editor for Sinister Grin Press.

Show 382 Notes: Shane Ryan, Westall UFO

Simulcast, YouTube Live Streamed and on KGRA Radio Tuesday, December 10th @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-5)

Guest Shane Ryan joins us from Canberra, Australia to discuss the 1966 Westall Flying Saucer Incident, a schoolyard encounter.

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SHANE RYAN is a teacher, writer, researcher and federal public servant in Australia. He has worked at Charles Sturt University, the University of Canberra, and the Australian National University, all in Canberra. Shane has worked as an information officer and researcher at the Embassy of Japan in Canberra, and he has also taught in schools in Japan and Australia. Shane completed a Diploma of Japanese Studies at Nanzan University, Nagoya, Japan; a Bachelor of Theology at Sydney College of Divinity, Sydney; a Master of Arts at Australian Catholic University, Canberra; and a Graduate Certificate in Teaching English as a Second Language and Foreign Language Teaching at the University of Canberra. He was working as a barristers’ clerk in Melbourne when he first heard about the incredible 1966 Westall Flying Saucer Incident in that city, for which he has now become the lead researcher. Shane was the principal researcher and narrator for the documentary on the Westall Incident, Westall ’66: A Suburban UFO Mystery, which was first broadcast on the Australian Sci Fi Channel in 2010. Shane has since made a serious study of other school-based UFO sightings around the world, such as the 1967 Crestview Elementary School Incident in Opa-Locka, Florida, USA, and other Australian sightings, from the 1960s era. Shane was instrumental in convincing local government authorities to establish Australia’s – and possibly the world’s – first UFO park and playground based on real events, at Westall in 2013, as a way of commemorating the events there. Shane appeared in both seasons of Discovery Channel Canada’s Close Encounters series, in the National Geographic UK TV Channel’s Invasion Earth series, Australia’s Network Ten’s Studio Ten program’s anniversary special on Westall, and on Japan’s Fuji TV Network’s What’s This? – Mysteries from Around the World program. He was also interviewed for James Fox’s upcoming feature documentary film The Phenomenon. There are also several TV and film producers currently planning projects to bring the Westall story to a wider audience. Shane lives in Canberra with his wife and two sons and works in the Education and Visitor Services team at Australian Parliament House.

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Show 381 Notes: Chris Lambright, US Navy & UFOs

Simulcast, YouTube Live Streamed and on KGRA Radio Tuesday, December 3rd @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-5)

Guest Chris Lambright discusses his research into the US Navy, and its relation to UFOs, which includes the USS Nimitz UFO Encounter, also Bigelow Aerospace as well as connections between the US government & TTSA and more.

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CHRISTIAN LAMBRIGHT has worked extensively in Computer Technology and Internet services, has a background in graphic arts, illustration, and CGI, and holds a degree in Psychology from Baylor University. He is a former investigator for the Center for UFO Studies and contributor to the Computer UFO Network, and is a licensed private investigator. Currently in Austin, Texas, he is working on a documentary film on a classic sighting, doing independent research, and always writing.

A summary of what will be discussed is included in Chris’ paper below

Note: For Active Links Version, click HERE

Questions on BAASS-Nimitz-TTSA_v2_wLinks

Show 380 Notes: BRYCE ZABEL

Simulcast, YouTube Live Streamed and on KGRA Radio Tuesday, November 26th @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-5)

Screenwriter – producer, author – journalist, Bryce Zabel’s website:


  • Creator of Five Produced Primetime TV Drama Series
  • Individual Winner: Writers Guild, Sidewise Award for Alternate History,
  • Series Winner: Emmy, Gemini
  • Chairman/CEO of the Television Academy
  • Writer of a #1 Box-Office Film
  • Adjunct Professor at USC School of Cinematic Arts
  • Member of DGA, WGA, SAG
  • On-air Anchor/Reporter for CNN, PBS, NBC

CNN correspondent-turned-screenwriter Bryce Zabel has created five primetime network television series and worked on a dozen TV writing staffs. A produced feature writer in both live-action and animation, he has written and produced for nearly all major networks and studios and collaborated with talents like Steven Spielberg, David Kelley and Stan Lee on projects that include series, video-games, comic books and web content.

In 2008, Bryce (with his wife, Jackie) received the Writers Guild of America (WGA) award for writing his third four-hour Hallmark mini-series, Pandemic. He has received credit on produced films and miniseries that include Atlantis: The Lost Empire, Mortal Kombat: Annihilation, Blackbeard, and NBC’s primetime The Poseidon Adventure. He wrote Syfy’s first original film, Official Denial, and the first film in the Unsolved Mysteries MOW franchise, Victim of Love. He has also worked for ABC, CBS, FOX, HBO, Showtime, SONY, Warner Bros., 20th Fox, Universal, USA, Animal Planet, etc. Read more

Show 379 Notes: Jeff Bennett & Deep Prasad

Simulcast, YouTube Live Streamed and on KGRA Radio Tuesday, November 19th @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-5)

HOUR ONE: Astrophysicist Jeffrey Bennett on astrobiology, the possibilities of intelligent life in our universe and much more. HOUR TWO: Deep Prasad, quantum computing, artificial intelligence, extraterrestrial artifacts, UFOs and more.

JEFF BENNETT (Ph.D., Astrophysics, CU 1987) has taught at every level from pre-school through graduate school and is now a full-time writer/speaker/educator focusing on student and public understanding of math and science. He is the lead author of best-selling college textbooks in astronomy, astrobiology, mathematics, and statistics; of six books for children that have all been read by astronauts from the International Space Station and of critically acclaimed books for the general public on topics including the search for extraterrestrial life, Einstein’s theory of relativity, and global warming. His writing as earned numerous awards, including the American Institute of Physics Science Communication Award. Other major endeavors include serving as a Visiting Senior Scientist at NASA Headquarters, where he led efforts to forge stronger links between the research and education communities; proposing and co-leading development of both the Colorado Scale Model Solar System on the CU campus and the Voyage Scale Model Solar System on the National Mall in Washington, DC; and leading the creation of the free app “Totality” for solar eclipses. His personal web site is

Joe Rogan Experience #1388 – Louie Psihoyos

DEEP PRASAD is working with the world’s first quantum computers in order to help build the infrastructure that will support the next decades worth of quantum technologies. His goal is to save humanity hundreds of billions of research hours in developing the next generation of photovoltaics, superconductors and metamaterials. In his spare time, he advises several blockchain startups focussed on healthcare applications. Deep was named one of Toronto’s Top 20 under 20 in 2015. He has given talks on many cutting edge technologies including the intersection of AI with Blockchain and Healthcare, as well as Quantum Computing.

Upcoming Guest, Preston Dennett

Simulcast, YouTube Live Streamed and on KGRA Radio Tuesday, November 12th @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-5)


Schoolyard UFO Encounters

Blue Giant Books, 2019

ISBN: 9781075776984

238 pages

Aliens at school! Extraterrestrials on the playground!

For the past 170 years, schools across the United States and the world have been targeted and visited by UFOs. These are not simple fly-overs. In these cases, the objects hover for long periods at extremely low elevation, often landing next to the school. In many cases, humanoids are seen. Elementary schools, junior high and high schools, colleges and universities — all have been targeted.  The ETs are here, and they are coming for our children. Read more

Show 377 Notes: Kathleen Marden, Stacey Wright & Marianne Robb

Simulcast, YouTube Live Streamed and on KGRA Radio Tuesday, November 5th @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-4)


KATHLEEN MARDEN, BA, CHt, QHHT is a one of the world’s foremost authorities on UFO contact, the author of several books, a featured on-camera commentator, and an international lecturer. She earned a BA degree in social work and worked as an educator and education services coordinator while attending graduate school. She is a practitioner of regression hypnosis and the Quantum Healing Hypnosis Technique. Her interest in UFOs and contact began in 1961, when her aunt and uncle Betty and Barney Hill, had a close encounter and subsequent abduction in New Hampshire’s White Mountains. She is a generational experiencer. Read more

Show 376 Notes: Jennifer Stein & Peter Robbins on James Forrestal

Simulcast, YouTube Live Streamed and on KGRA Radio Tuesday, October 29th @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-4)

JENNIFER W. STEIN is a self-taught filmmaker who never went to film school. She is an entrepreneur who started making films in the 1990’s while running non-profit organizations, raising her two children, and running a special events business.

Clients and Contractors: Merck, Unisys, QVC-TV, McNeil Pharmaceuticals, Rohm & Haas, CNN, Cigna, NFL Films, Johnson & Johnson, Travellers Insurance, IBM, Devereux Foundation, Penn Foundation, Campbell’s Soup, Fluidics, Capital Mortgage, Nowco International, Hartley Films, Banyan Productions, WMMR Radio, PM-TV, Sefcik Productions, Janis Productions, The ARE – Edgar Cayce Foundation, Barrie AV, Lafayette Hill Studios, Eden Institute, Arc of Chester County, Super Value Supermarkets, Thomas Catanese Productions, The Media Shop, Multi-Media Productions, IEBA Communications, The Blue Army, The Bucks County Chamber of Commerce, and others.

PETER ROBBINS is one of America’s most respected investigative writers specializing in the subject of UFOs. He is a regular guest on radio programs and podcasts and has appeared as a guest on and been consultant to numerous television shows and documentaries. The two have worked together on numerous projects over the past years, one of which was “TRAVIS: The True Story of Travis Walton” which Stein was Executive Producer on and Robbins an Associate Producer.

BOB TERRIO: (not a guest) Assisted and was heavily involved in this film. Since graduating from the Rochester Institute of Technology in 1974, Bob has perfected his skills as a producer, director, cameraman and editor of film and video productions. Bob has worked in all areas of production including commercial, corporate, industrial, advertising, broadcast, wedding and social events, and documentary programs. Bob’s skills also include animation, art direction and storyboards.

Peter Robbins Extensive Bio:

Peter Robbins is an investigative writer, author and lecturer whose writing and research are focused on the subject of truly anomalous UFOs and their implications for humanity. He has appeared as a guest on and been consultant to numerous radio shows, television programs and documentaries. Read more

Show 375 Notes: Erling Strand & Seth Shostak

Simulcast, YouTube Live Streamed and on KGRA Radio Tuesday, October 22nd @ 6:00PM to 8:00PM ET (GMT-4)



ERLING P. STRAND: received a M.SC.EE. degree in 1981 at the Norwegian University of Science and Technology. Since 1988 he has been a lecturer and is an Asst. Professor at the School of Computer Sciences, Østfold University College, in Norway. He is also one of the founders of Project Hessdalen and, since 1993, the project manager. The main goal of the Project is to learn more about the mysterious lights in the Hessdalen valley in Norway.

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