Show #570 Notes: James Fox & Dean Alioto

Simulcast on KGRA Radio, YouTube, Facebook & Twitch – Tuesday, August 15, @ 7:00 PM EDT (-4GMT)

 

JAMES FOX BIO: For 27 years, James Fox traveled across the world in pursuit of the truth regarding UFOs. He directed and produced five films on the subject, “Out of the Blue, (2003); “I Know What I Saw” & Director’s Cut Edition, (2009); “The Phenomenon”, (2020) and “Moment of Contact”, (2022)“. In 2007 orchestrated an event, with help from journalist Leslie Kean (Coalition for Freedom of Information), which to this day is hailed as the most credible civilian effort of disclosure on UFOs in history. His last film The Phenomenon was a worldwide hit and became a hot news story event due to former minority senate leader, Harry Reid, who stated in Fox’s documentary that “Most of it (UFO evidence) hasn’t seen the light of day.” For his latest film, Moment of Contact, Fox goes where’s he’ never gone before in the phenomenon — reporting on recovered aliens. Taking place in Varginha Brazil in 1996, Fox uncovers new witnesses and reveals information on a cover up that has not seen the light on day for 26 years.

DEAN ALIOTO BIO: Dean Alioto has a premium 3-part limited science series coming out next year that looks at the UFO/alien phenomenon from an entirely new point of view. It features top Harvard, Oxford, and NASA scientist and features several new theories and experiencer evidence. In addition, Dean has a feature film documentary also coming out next year featuring new alien experiencers and well known experts in the field of alien abductions. Dean’s previous work includes the enigmatic alien abduction movie The McPherson tape, as well as the Paramount TV remake, Alien Abduction: Incident in Lake County. He has appeared on Paramount +, Fox, and on the BBC. Dean also consulted on the James Fox feature doc The Phenomenon.

 

Transcript 

0:44

I love the guy’s energy he’s the hardest uh I would say hands down he’s the

0:50

hardest working person in the UFO world uh that’s focused on the UFO topic I

0:56

always loved talking to him after that Dean alioto who’s also a filmmaker and we’ve got a lot to cover with him as

1:03

well uh the blog this week is a possible 1978 UFO Abduction case from British

1:10

Columbia by uh Charles Lear so a couple of things uh we are in the audio podcast

1:15

we are running some commercials so you can skip all that all you have to do is uh join patreon for two dollars or more

1:23

a month and the link is right on the website podcast ufo.com and also the

1:28

audio blogs are going to be um on there as well so anyway uh I am so excited to

1:34

bring in James I’m not even going to blab anymore more James welcome oh thanks for having me on Martin yeah it’s

1:40

always fun having you on and uh I you know I posted a clip of you uh telling

1:47

Michael Shermer exactly what you you thought it was his ideas and uh that

1:52

kind of went viral a lot of people loved that uh that’s that’s really great I mean I could see you like you could see

1:58

you getting all antsy and when he was talking and like you couldn’t take it any longer and it’s true and just let’s

2:05

just recap exactly what that was about it’s the thing you always hear a skeptic say and that is they talk about the

2:12

explainable UFO sightings and encounters yeah I mean those we’re not interested

2:18

in those we know that already you’re just wasting my time like you’re just taking up space it’s so frustrating I’ve

2:25

had it and I sat there and I was like oh my God I can’t believe he’s doing this you know and I was oh I was getting I

2:33

was boiling over yeah yep and then you let him have it it

2:38

was great and then you know a lot of people said to me well what did what did Michael Shermer say to that I mean what

2:44

was it was response nothing I watched the whole interview he never had a you

2:49

know never said anything to that never had a rebuttal he he knows yeah believe

2:54

me he knows he’s not an idiot yeah no he’s a very smart guy yeah and actually he’s a nice guy I actually had him on

3:00

this show before yeah and he was very you know he was uh you know he was

3:06

polite and uh you know he wasn’t too offensive I I was all ready to go with him you know and and he he he was he

3:13

knew he was on a UFO show so he really behaved I he

3:19

I’ve had interaction with him for at least 20 years I want to say

3:26

that I sent him a copy of out of the blue

3:32

and that would have been early 2000s because I did a couple versions of out of the blue I had a I

3:39

went back to the drawing board as as one does but I I think I gave him an early copy of out of the blue

3:46

and he gave me a quote and it was a very nice quote

3:51

like I was I was shocked and you know we’ve been we’ve debated this topic on uh Larry King and oh yeah different

3:58

different places I mean James McGaha is much worse I don’t know whatever happened to that guy but James McGaha

4:04

and I went at it one time I think it might have been on Anderson Cooper and he was just oh my it was it was so bad

4:12

he was talking about how Pilots didn’t know what they were talking about and they were not you know uh better

4:18

observers yeah better qualified observers like what are you talking about you idiot

4:24

well you know you’re wearing you’re hiding your shirt you can just barely see it the phenomenon but I I love that

4:30

movie and it was on the Travel Channel the other night and you know the very

4:35

beginning of that movie when that guy is when you’re in that actually the bomber or whatever it is

4:41

oh my God and that guy talks about that encounter and what an encounter that was

4:48

I mean it was a perfectly shaped saucer flying over the field below them which

4:54

is really something I mean that’s a that’s a great military encounter it’s such a compelling encounter it was nine

5:00

minutes in duration it started it like I want to say 10 to 12 000 foot

5:07

elevation and it ends up at Treetop level where they thought they were going to collide with this disc

5:13

you know and then the guy who’s a World War II pilot and a colonel in the Air Force ends up being put like his public

5:19

spokes officer from Project Blue Book like you know eight ten years later I mean you know talk about a good

5:26

witness and of course what’s the first thing he did when they when he became involved with Project Blue Book

5:32

did he he went to look for his sighting oh he did oh he did oh wow I didn’t know

5:38

that you heard in 1955 and you know Project Blue Book was in full swing and

5:43

they all gave detailed accounts and he said that there were engineers from like Lockheed Martin I think it was Boeing

5:48

and Lockheed and they were you know these were very smart trained observers and they were just baffled

5:55

one of the things that Colonel Coleman said was that they were separated and debriefed and gave statements

6:03

and that their their testimony all aligned perfectly like they all experience exactly the same thing they

6:08

describe the same thing and um so Colonel William Coleman when they when

6:14

he was part of Project Blue Book years later he went to find his encounter and

6:19

guess what but it wasn’t there it was a project book and the reason being

6:26

the better the the better the witness the more qualified the eyewitness the

6:31

more compelling the encounter the less likely the Air Force will ever want you

6:36

to see it or hear about it because those are the cases that they cannot explain those are the ones that we’re interested

6:42

in hearing about no did they go somewhere else do you think well obviously I mean they

6:48

took they didn’t throw it away yeah yeah I wonder what if there’s footage

6:53

involved you can you could you could say that’s going to go magic bye-bye as well yeah I’ve been in touch with a colonel

6:59

right now for the United States Air Force who’s a fighter pilot and had this dramatic encounter in 1980 I mean it’s

7:04

it’s phenomenal and I’ve been he came forward anonymously um recently I think I posted it on my

7:10

Twitter account but he’s very seriously contemplating coming fully forward he

7:16

shot gun cam footage of this of this object and um it was a very dramatic encounter and of course that footage was

7:22

taken once again never to be seen or heard of yeah what was his debriefing

7:28

like do you know he said there was a guy in a dark suit in the room huh I didn’t say anything there was you

7:35

know and then he was asked never to talk about the incident yeah and that the gun cam footage that he shot was taken

7:42

and I mean honestly he’s still concerned this to this day I mean what is that 43 years later it was in 1980

7:51

you think I you know I’ve said this before a number of times on the show makes you wonder where all this footage

7:57

is this great footage going all the way back to you know what uh Gordon uh saw

8:02

there on the planes and and uh that big uh was a Big Sur I’m trying to think of

8:08

that yeah uh Jacobs uh Robert Jacobs uh Vandenberg

8:13

Air Force Base Circa 1965. yeah and there’s so many I like

8:20

that yeah that guy is so believable there was not a you know not a iota of

8:25

doubt the gentleman was telling me the truth I mean you you heard his he’s so believable right yeah you know so it

8:33

makes you wonder where all that goes well I have to ask you James that there’s I’m getting email and I know you

8:39

are too um do you have any opinion on what might be going on in Peru it’s such a crazy

8:45

story you know I don’t I have been getting

8:53

so many I mean so many requests so many um questions regarding that incident

9:01

um I did reach out to um my counterpart Marco Leal in in

9:06

Brazil yeah he seems to think there’s some substance to it he wants to go

9:12

um and he very well might go I uh I I don’t I cannot speak intelligently about

9:18

it because I simply don’t have any valid in any more than than what the rest of

9:23

us have at this and I know you’ve been you’ve been working really really hard because I I almost had to threaten your

9:28

life to get you on this show yeah I’m shooting and editing a new movie

9:35

so I’ve eighty percent of it shot I’m dealing with some government insiders

9:40

some Intel folks insiders that are going through the process uh of The Whistleblower process that David crush

9:47

went through that want to come forward um so I’m trying to work that angle

9:52

um trying to look into the David grush accounts and and meet with representatives and you know

10:00

um schedule shoots yeah see what I come up with at the end of the day yeah well I can’t wait for

10:07

that I and I I know uh the last one uh moment of contact you put that thing

10:12

together really really fast for one of these type of of movies and uh that did

10:18

that did really well well I did but keep in mind that we spent the better part of 12 Years on and off investigating that

10:25

case and I went back and forth five times in Brazil oh I didn’t realize but but when you got

10:31

all the footage done you really put that thing together we cranked yeah I’m doing this I’m trying to do the same same

10:37

thing with this one in fact I um I wanted this one to be

10:43

very like I wanted to be the most beautiful documentary I’ve ever created

10:49

so I really like I I hired um really uh seasoned photographers I

10:58

mean the same gentleman that I’ve had DP David West but then he brought in another person Who does these beautiful uh I want to

11:05

call them time lapse they’re like motion time lapse where they set up cameras on tracks we got permits all across

11:11

Washington DC I mean if you’ve ever seen the series House of Cards on Netflix oh

11:17

yeah like that kind of photography I just wanted it because the epicenter of a lot

11:23

of what’s happening for this push for transparency and and what’s going on is happening in Washington DC right now and

11:28

it’s phenomenal what’s happening behind the scenes and I’m just getting a tiny taste of it I can only imagine how much

11:34

more is going on and uh so I wanted to I wanted the heart of the film to kind of

11:40

you know revolve around DC so we went there for five weeks almost five weeks

11:46

and we shot we’re going back in a couple weeks let me shot the most beautiful b-roll I’ve ever seen of Washington DC I

11:53

mean we got permits we set up cameras on tracks it’s just stunning oh my goodness

11:59

wow I’m telling you man and then I got a composer in London who’s doing the music and I I mean we’re going we’re really

12:04

going all out I want this to be it’s most I mean I’m trying to make it

12:10

the most beautiful dock I’ve ever made I’m trying wow I remember you saying that about the phenomenon and you did

12:15

that was your you know that that was a beautiful film all your work is great I

12:22

love all your work um I’ve it’s I’ve told many people over the years even when I first started that

12:28

you know out of the blue I know what I saw all those movies you you did way back then and you said no you didn’t

12:35

like those you wanted to do better and uh you did that with a phenomenon and uh

12:40

I know you had a lot of years since that I remember when you first I remember the

12:45

first title and the first few struggles you had in that you know the 701 I believe it was called or something like

12:52

that and uh one thing I’ve learned is I work best

13:01

solo and what I mean by that I had some opportunities when the

13:06

phenomenon came out to um do some stuff with Netflix and

13:12

things of you know but then I would have had Executives breathing over my neck when I collaborate with too many people

13:21

I don’t know I I can’t I feel restrained I’m much better

13:27

got my little edit Studio behind us yeah you know I got a core crew that I’ve been working with for

13:34

quite some time um one of which is is this gentleman Boris and and uh he worked with my on my

13:41

first documentary with me back when I was in my early 20s and we’re still working together today and uh and we just are a good team we

13:49

get along we always deliver and uh and we do it on a smaller budget in an

13:55

independent spot like this subcontract out work when I need it if I need some help with like writing or something I’ll

14:01

bring somebody in yeah but that’s it I want to do it completely independently and I want any Executives breathing over

14:07

my neck or that kind of thing and so I’ve you know that’s what I’m doing now

14:12

I’m just gonna that’s all I’m gonna do and I know my first friend uh Chris O’Brien helps you out now and then he’s

14:18

a wonderful human being love him yeah he’s great yeah he’s a vagabond he’s all over the place

14:24

I don’t know is he I don’t know where he is right now uh but yeah he’s a great guy so smart oh my God yeah he’s very

14:32

intelligent he’s got some great stories too and uh that’s you know getting back to I

14:38

heard you mentioned rush you know I mean I just want to touch on this negative thing real quickly and then get out of

14:45

it it’s just my opinion anyway and that’s the uh intercept uh Ken

14:50

clippenstein you know I I don’t I can’t see I’ve been

14:56

trying to give I know an open mind to his article but i i s I can’t see any

15:02

other purpose for that than a negative uh spin to David rush I don’t know what

15:07

else it could be you know it is it is as right as a journalist to do what he did but um you know but it kind of points to

15:15

the evidence that he got to know where to look because the names would be redacted

15:21

you know so he knew where to look and when to look for it so here’s what I do know and I’ve heard this from from two

15:28

very credible sources that the uh writers of the last two smear campaigns

15:35

um were both uh tipped off where to look and that came from inside the Intel

15:42

folks that’s what I was told yeah really that’s what happened like hey you might want to look over here I mean I I’d say

15:48

to to those those folks um we should be

15:55

putting all of our energy into uh validating the claims that are made

16:02

by this this intelligence officer David Crush um he was willing to testify under oath

16:08

he’s put everything on the line his entire reputation his life

16:13

um the the media particularly the mainstream media should be really asking questions this guy handed us on a silver

16:20

platter probably one of the biggest stories in the history of mankind and you know instead of putting the energy

16:26

and resources into uh figuring out uh the validity of of the claims he made

16:32

there seems like they’re more interested in in smearing the poor guy so I’d say

16:38

focus on uh you know up turning up more witnesses more

16:46

documents more specifics and and the best we can that’s what we should all be focusing on right now yeah I’m concerned

16:54

well I wanted to show this right here this is uh I did get to meet him and I I

16:59

it was kind of funny I was filming while I was shaking his hand someone took a picture oh that’s great yeah but anyway

17:07

um I feel really concerned now I have a major witness coming up a military

17:13

witness coming up on uh September 5th and and the ones you are speaking of as

17:19

well uh and I’m almost afraid that they’re going to see how this is being treated and say forget it I don’t want

17:26

to talk about it yeah um he’s weathering the storm quite

17:32

nicely and I know people that are in the process of of of getting the

17:38

Whistleblower protection stuff I mean it’s a process they have to go through I think it’s with the icig might be the

17:43

administer or the office of Thomas monheim I believe but in any case

17:48

they’re starting that process and it’s a fairly I understand it’s it’s like maybe a week-long process

17:54

I’ll find out more but no I thought that I thought that whistleblower situation

17:59

had a deadline of like last April or something is this has this been extended which I think it should be

18:06

uh are you aware of how that works yeah no all I know is that there’s a

18:12

process that needs to before they come out and that they can’t release you know super classified data there’s parameters

18:18

on what they can they can talk about there’s a process to get to that and um and there are other people that are

18:24

first hand witnesses that are going through that process I I’m familiar with one of them quite well and uh so that’s

18:30

that’s that’s I think it’s imminent so I mean that that would be you know

18:37

people would ask me I’m sure they asked you the same question uh you know what do you hope happens with all this you

18:44

know the movement forward the hearing and all that and my answer has been that the first-hand witnesses actually do

18:51

come forward and you know that would I mean how could that be denied if they do

18:57

well I mean you know and firsthand witness is going to come forward and guess what they’re going to say oh yeah

19:03

well let’s just talk where’s the craft where are the bodies this is baloney just more claims without any evidence

19:09

that’s what they’re going to say and inevitably and but but all the evidence would be classified I would assume you

19:16

know look my response is this because I get criticized a lot with Virginia like oh yeah it’s just more more Talking

19:23

Heads more it’s like well yes but people

19:28

are coming forward in droves right now on the Virginia case there are doctors coming forward forensic Pathologists

19:34

coming forward talking about having seen the body or footage of the of the creature and and um and we’re talking

19:41

about it and we’re making a concerted effort to find the videotaped evidence that we know exists yeah we’re talking

19:47

about it well we’d like to get our hands on it of course we would but how are you going to talk about something you don’t

19:53

know exists you need to learn about the fact that it exists it’s like the satellite imagery right it’s like we’re

19:59

getting that dialogue going and people are starting to learn like okay we know through some pretty credible people that

20:05

that satellite data does exist and it’s very compelling right yes we haven’t gotten our hands on it

20:10

yet I’ve actually had people contact me this is kind of funny

20:16

um I’m trying to think how much I can say here but I’ve I’ve had individuals that uh that that claim

20:23

to have had the clearances and know exactly where it is so they’ve been

20:29

feeding that information to me and I’ve been feeding it to people on the inside like this is where it is and and it’s

20:35

aligning like oh yeah that makes total sense oh yes it would be on that database oh thank you for the you know

20:40

now whether or not those people that I’m feeding it to through this will be able to release it to the General Public

20:47

I don’t know I I hope so and I certainly hope that by them these individuals with

20:54

the clearances that they can get their hands on it I mean the more people talking about it the more

21:00

you know hopefully likely that something will either leak out or like it did with the Pentagon with the the videos of the

21:06

Tic Tac or enough pressure putting on DOD where they have to eventually release some

21:11

stuff uh I mean I get frustrated too for the audience

21:17

that are you know that criticize people that are just talking about evidence and not producing it but we got to start

21:23

somewhere and what do you think about you know how in Virginia the

21:28

it seems like the Americans showed up there uh this seems like a repeating

21:33

situation that I’ve heard a couple of other different times where uh you know

21:39

people show up and you know something how they knew about it and all that I mean it’s just all it’s really bizarre

21:47

how these things seem to happen and you know there’s accounts of of people showing up on a site you know with no

21:53

Insignia and black camo and you know and and all that and uh like taking over the

21:59

project that type of thing I never believed in any of this

22:04

I heard accounts for so long about these men in suits

22:11

that show up they’re from some unknown government U.S government agency I

22:16

avoided putting them in my films I heard them back in the 90s when I was investigating the the Phoenix Lights

22:23

case or the massive UFO flyover March 13 1997 and

22:28

um I I just kept hearing them kept hearing them kept hearing them kept hearing them and I think the final straw for me was

22:36

when I was in Virginia South American Brazil and the mother of the two daughters

22:42

mentioned these men in suits and that was like okay I really believe this woman and these men were intimidating

22:49

they were um they were intimidating very intimidating

22:55

and they were somewhat um there was a there was an air of of

23:01

mystery almost like I’m not going to say Supernatural but

23:06

they had that air about them that they just seemed there was something about them according to the eyewitness

23:12

testimony from people do that there was just something menacing there was

23:20

something odd you know what I mean something hmm

23:26

I don’t want to use the word otherworldly but but odd you know it’s I find I find the oddest part of it or one

23:35

of the oddest part parts of it is all of a sudden they show up well I remember even show up I remember the woman the

23:42

mother said she ran first of all she was very very intimidated when they arrived

23:48

she thought I was one of the fellow researchers like uber genre or or pekachini showing up just to talk with

23:55

her and it was these men in suits and and uh and she was scared I mean they

24:01

were very forceful trying to get you know her to take this deal were going to get her daughters to go on a TV show and

24:07

say the daughters were lying and all this stuff and she which she refused to do and uh but when they left and she

24:15

threatened to call the police and that’s when they finally left uh she ran after him she got this long Corridor outside

24:21

with a with a metal gate and she like ran up the corridor after the gate closed and she ran out there to see and

24:27

they were just gone you know there was just no sign of them in any direction she was kind of that that was odd and

24:34

the way they had to show up and the way they’re the the way they they seem to be omnipresent with really

24:39

good cases it’s just I don’t know man there’s something very strange about them I don’t know or maybe they’re just

24:46

trained to be that way I really don’t know yeah odd yeah and then you know on

24:52

site that the camo dudes as they call them you know from what I understand in black camo I’ve heard that in two

24:58

different situations you know and who the heck would they be and what what type of like a recovery team you know

25:04

that type of situation well you know I I honestly and I was investigating Virginia first of all I didn’t believe

25:11

Virginia for the longest time right I didn’t even want to waste my time with it um and I I would say at least 10 years

25:18

or 11 years so weird to think that I was in I was making documentaries on UFOs and I

25:23

refused to look into this case and then what caught me by surprise

25:28

was while we were the last time we were filming there

25:34

which had been in my I would my guess would be about two years ago uh there

25:40

was a I wish I could remember his name Marco something he was a everybody like part of the fire

25:46

department or police department or flight safety it’s all connected to the

25:52

government so it’s like the federal police the federal like so the military is connected to the fire department the

25:59

military is connected to the police department the military is connected to you know the flight control when they look at the radar and they and they

26:05

manage all incoming flights and everything yeah that individual came forward about two years ago while we were in

26:12

Brazil we tried to get an interview with them but it’s it’s all it’s it’s he did it on a podcast and he said that he

26:20

uh you can go look for it um he saw uh you know USAF he kept saying which is USF the United States

26:27

Air Force flight that came in and it didn’t have authorization and it landed in and then and that he

26:35

was like this plane doesn’t have authorization you need authorization and then one of the higher-ups came into the

26:41

room this is all videotaped he’s talking about this I came in and said let the plane land and it landed in Campinas

26:47

right around January 20th or 21st of 1996. so you have an you have an

26:52

unauthorized United States Air Force airplane that lands in Campinas right at

26:57

the time where we have you know on-camera testimony from people claiming to have driven the

27:04

the being or beings to Campinas right around that time high level of I mean

27:11

that’s you know it’s pretty compelling evidence somebody sent me and of course I I just got

27:18

barraged with uh Twitter and email oh my gosh when I went on Joe Rogan I could

27:25

barely keep up with it I mean it was a full-time job but I was following leads somebody sent me a photograph

27:31

um in of of a uh trying to think would play was it a um

27:38

sorry guys I’m not that uh proficient with my different types of airplanes but

27:44

it was a it was the United States airplane plane and it was large enough to put a

27:50

a tank and a tank or two or or a couple of Blackhawk helicopters I think maybe

27:57

one or possibly two and um I’m working with it with the United

28:03

States uh a a retired United States Air Force colonel

28:09

that has been trying to help me locate that plane but the tail numbers in the photograph are just a little too blurry

28:15

but you can see the flags in the number and the and the colors so we’ve we’re pretty sure we know what base it’s

28:21

coming from but we don’t have the actual cell numbers so we’ve been trying to get that individual who sent me the first to

28:26

scan it better because he took a photograph of him holding it and then sent it to me but if he could scan it

28:32

then we’d probably get the tail numbers so you know we’re we’re really trying to

28:38

we’re we’re really following up on that we’re following I follow up on leads with with Virginia daily and um and I

28:46

gotta say when I watched David grush testify under oath that was a very

28:52

uh that was a milestone that was yeah that was something else and you were there I was right there and I just

28:59

barely got in I mean I was the second to last person in the door um and then you know just last night

29:06

this is funny last night I’m looking at there was footage of people going down the line and around the corner and about

29:11

300 people down I saw this very distinct kid and I remember he was sitting three

29:17

rows in front of me somehow he’s snuck in all these people stuck in you got to

29:22

be kidding no he was like 300 people behind me and he got you know he got in

29:27

like the second row he’s he’s in the a lot of the uh the news footage so here’s

29:33

a very nice comment here uh James I’m a professor who has taught a research writing course behind uh based on UFOs

29:40

and the Paranormal the student’s first assignment is to watch the phenomenon

29:46

isn’t that nice oh that’s right that’s so nice thank you for that yeah no it’s it’s

29:53

always it’s so great I mean it’s such it’s it was so great that we that the

29:59

Stars aligned and we were able to to make the phenomenon that’s exactly what it’s supposed to be used for as a tool I

30:05

mean documenting all that history and all the archive material and stuff it

30:11

was really important to put those pieces of the puzzle together in a way that people that are unfamiliar with the

30:16

topic could make sense of it all and and uh and have a much better foundation for

30:22

uh understanding uh the complexity of of the phenomenon

30:27

so what is what is the most rewarding part of doing what you’re doing is it things like that or is it uh you know

30:34

the connections you make when you’re involved and and doing these things

30:43

I’m very curious and I always like to kind of get to the bottom of things and I’m coming to the

30:49

realization that I’m probably not going to get to the bottom of it but I am certainly learning more

30:54

and it’s been very gratifying one thing the phenomenon did for me is it’s open

31:00

doors and I I have relationships with people behind the scenes now for the first time

31:05

more so than ever before and and and and and that’s and

31:11

I I just really want to know I really want to know as much as I can learn about what’s going on and I

31:18

obviously I’ll share as much of that obviously always with the general public

31:24

um I I think I’m just very curious by nature and and um I

31:32

I just want to know I want to know I feel like we we all have a right to know

31:37

whether it’s you know a little scary I mean the unknown’s always a little scary right yeah or whatever it is it doesn’t

31:44

change reality doesn’t change I mean the facts coming forward doesn’t change our

31:49

reality it’s still we’re still you know I I think that’s a great answer and

31:54

there’s there is so many uh things that we just can’t even sense with our senses

32:01

and there may be things around us that we don’t even know are existing you know there’s there’s uh and that whole idea

32:09

of uh another dimension being a possibility I mean there’s there’s so

32:14

many things and I like one of the I think shock valet or someone says something

32:19

along the lines we may not even understand if we knew we may not even understand which I think is uh very

32:26

possible so we have someone we’re going to join us to say hi to you at least James

32:33

Richard Dean how are you sir brother what’s up not much you gotta I don’t

32:39

know if your microphones I’m hearing squeak squeak yeah your microphone’s not

32:45

Jesus I thought you were a pro man I know you hear me now well we can hear you but it’s like you have to go into

32:51

settings little piggy or something a cartoon all

32:57

right hold on here yeah so James do you have uh

33:02

do you have a working title have you thought of a working title no but but you’re overall I mean I have

33:10

a working title but I don’t like it yeah okay we’re gonna call it something but it’s not I don’t even want to announce

33:15

it because it doesn’t yeah it’s not going to be the title yeah and I I keep thinking like every time I’ve never had

33:22

a title for any film I’ve ever done until the last minute right like what I did what I did I know what I

33:29

saw I was like what’s the title what’s the title I don’t know you know and I’m in the edit Studio and I kept hearing this witness going

33:35

they’re out of frustration I look I know what I saw okay yeah stop telling me

33:41

what I didn’t see you know and I thought well it has a nice ring to it you know and I’ve had all I’ve had a lot

33:48

of people say you know just in conversation on the street talking about you know and they kind of bring up

33:54

something like that well I know what I saw and it sure wasn’t a you know it wasn’t one of ours you know that type of

34:00

thing yeah they’ll say that I still think that that Elm holds up well and it’s a great job

34:06

that’s a great title and I love out of the blue I love that title yeah I like a title that doesn’t scream

34:12

UFO it has subtle like subtle it’s subtle you know yeah like moment of contact

34:19

I was in the field because I always want I when I talk to a witness that’s got to

34:27

experience something that I would love to experience you know what I mean like whether it’s standing under a craft or

34:32

seeing a landing craft I mean imagine watching a craft land and the door open you know it’s just ah it’s unfathomable

34:39

but when I was meeting the women and I’d known them I was saying to them like gosh when you

34:46

locked eyes with this creature and I know it was such a quick like fleeting

34:51

moment but put me there what did you feel what did you see like you know time

34:58

slows down when you have those experiences and I remember I said that during that moment of contact when you

35:04

locked eyes and later I thought hmm moment contact huh that’s I like that

35:10

you know ask a couple people oh yeah that’s a winner looked it up Googled it the other day I did

35:17

I Googled I I thought about something because I kept hearing people refer to the program you know people that are

35:24

working with uh UAP or whatever and uh but then I Googled it and I was like no

35:31

but it was close it was a contender for a moment yeah you know uh summer some

35:37

acidic from uh the Ariel oh I know her well I love that yeah she’s a lovely

35:43

lovely person you know when she tells me she made the con you know the she said

35:48

to me that breaking contact eye contact with that being that was only four feet

35:54

away from her was one of the hardest things she ever had to do in her life breaking away from it you know she was

36:01

curious about how her siblings were on the playground and she had to force herself to look away from it but I mean

36:08

I but she had she had she didn’t get any message like some of the kids claimed they did you know but it’s not that she

36:15

remembers and she doesn’t really want to know I’ve asked her if she wanted to you know ever wanted to go into some type of

36:21

regression you know hypnotherapy to see if she could recall anything she I don’t think she wants to she said Dean let’s

36:27

try your let’s try your audio can you hear me yes that’s better all right good

36:34

um James always great to see you brother likewise um so what James didn’t tell you is that

36:39

before 407 there was another title of his film it was everything you want to

36:45

know about UFOs but are afraid to ask and more and more and more and more and

36:51

I said I’m not sure about that and it came back with 407 I said I just one word

36:56

Phenom do you mean uh 701 right yes I’m

37:02

like there were several number of combinations and then one word like Facebook and he said the

37:10

phenomenon and I said if that if that works for you fine

37:15

so that’s how that one happened in the edit room we heard the phenomenon

37:20

I was working with it with a gentleman Mark barish a brilliant writer really great researcher and um

37:28

we were bouncing names off each other for quite some time and we we were bombarded with every interview

37:34

people saying the phenomenon it was even like uh uh Senator or former Senate Majority

37:42

Leader Harry Reid had used that word during the interview and I hadn’t thought of it but Mark Parish my partner

37:48

at the time writing partner uh was like hey what do you think about the phenomenon I was like oh dude that one’s

37:54

been staring Us in the face this whole time like that’s and we looked it up you know of course we don’t

37:59

people people are like oh yeah I went to watch a movie and I got John Travolta I was like oh yeah that’s phenomenon you

38:05

gotta it’s got you got to put it the then it’s like you know what is it

38:12

Shameless Shameless plugin good Lord so that is that what you do James you you

38:17

Google to see if you can find any names of past movies I do yeah yeah yeah

38:23

that’s the first thing I do you kind of have to check it out yeah making a film you want to make sure that you’re the

38:29

first or I remember the Alien Abduction film I did there’s tons of films called alien abduction yeah

38:34

um but yeah you kind of want to make sure that you’re branding out there the first time and that was a perfect name

38:41

oh yeah and I love the I love like titles I was talking to Martin about

38:46

this a minute when you when you so rudely left us with your bad microphone but uh I like titles that don’t scream

38:53

UFO they’re subtle you know and uh and I loved out of the blue I know what I saw

39:00

um the phenomenon is brilliant I love that title and um moment of contact I think it’s it’s

39:06

appropriate for you know like that moment of contact I think and I and I

39:12

hope that you know we’ll come up with something similar for this one I think it should be I know you’re gonna think

39:18

I’m crazy but that should be the title that’s already taken Martin oh that’s

39:23

already taken yeah but yeah that’s how a lot of people tell me about their UFO sightings well I know you might think

39:30

I’m a little crazy but this you know yeah I don’t think that one would flow too well but yeah no uh I’m looking at

39:39

we have the entire movie mapped out on the wall right here oh if only we could see it I know I know

39:45

and I’m looking at I’m just thinking that the title is probably on one of these we have these big white uh

39:53

boards that we I actually had a friend of mine come over he’s got brilliant handwriting I was like can you do this

39:59

please I’m sorry like a storyboard type of

40:04

thing yeah storyboard yeah we got X1 X2 X3 I think it’ll be yeah I think the end result will be pretty damn close to what

40:10

we’re uh you know things change a little here and there but I think I have a pretty good pretty powerful act one act

40:17

two act three I think it’s going to be a really good I do I don’t think like people like yourselves are going to

40:23

learn that much um maybe a little bit but I think for the general public once again I’m

40:29

creating I’m trying to create you know something that could you know

40:35

explain what’s been going on since 2017 uh to a more mainstream audience because

40:43

it’s pretty it’s pretty crazy you know I want to go to watch for the time lapse footage to be honest because

40:50

I hear you’re going to have incredible time lapse footage oh so pretty that’s that’s where I get off that’s my soap

40:57

that’s nice give me some nice time lapse yeah no oh really I I looked at it I was

41:03

like this is my guy he’s the most beautiful I’ve ever seen I’m sorry in Washington I shot their

41:10

March that’s not too bad I was there in

41:16

January shooting for my film and it was insanely cold I couldn’t work the focus

41:21

oh my God it’s really really cold in DC yeah yeah so one of the things uh that

41:27

you just said there James is is something that I have to be more sensitive of because I every once in a

41:33

while I’ll read some of the comments I get on YouTube things like that and someone wrote something along the lines

41:39

well hey you know you’re acting like everyone knows this story I know and this was actually the Ariel phenomenon

41:46

you know the Ariel School incident of course um so and they’re saying you’re acting like everyone knows this I don’t know

41:53

this story so you know it’s kind of ridiculous I’m going to stop listening and so we all have to be I think uh

41:59

there’s so many new people coming in looking at this topic because of all the publicity that we really have to you

42:06

know kind of keep everyone happy if we can somehow by giving them a nutshell of

42:12

what’s going on and James I know you’ve got to go you’ve uh you’ve graced us for uh longer than a half an hour which I it

42:20

was hard to get out of you and uh I know you’re you you said you got a lot to do so I don’t want to abuse that I’m

42:27

leaving in a few days to go to Europe and then when I get back from Europe I’m only around for a couple of days and then I gotta go doing another shoot in

42:33

DC and I got shoots all across I should be done shooting the movie by the end of

42:38

September and my goal is to have a rough cut by by you know the end of the year or early uh

42:45

2024 and have the film come out in um uh in the summer of 2024

42:50

so that’s my goal and you know inevitably well

42:56

excuse me bug that flew right in my mouth oh God this got swallowed too I saw him flying right here and he went right in

43:03

my mouth you know what you saw right yeah oh my God I know what what my mouth

43:08

that was God came out of the boy oh you’ve heard of an old cow barn so what

43:14

do you expect right before I was rudely interrupted by a bug

43:20

you were talking about how phenomenon basically took you eight years yeah well now you’re banging them out you’re doing

43:27

great remember us doing a hike and you saying or me saying you eight years I don’t know if that’s sustainable and all

43:33

of a sudden it’s like once a year or a year and a half you’re doing it you’re like in the flow bringing it and uh and

43:42

the last one I thought was a great milestone and where you’re going as a as a filmmaker and I’m you know looking

43:47

forward to this one as usual well thank you guys well I tell you I thought that that moment of contact was was risky

43:54

um and I had a number of people that were very concerned like you just came from you know where you push the

44:00

envelope a bit with the phenomenon and now you’re dealing with a crash and live aliens walking through a town like I had

44:05

a lot of people like are you sure you want to do this you know I was like well I’m yes I am

44:12

but I knew it was a Gamble and uh but I think that that uh you know I think it’s it got discovered I think three or four

44:19

months after it came out I mean the film was competing with avatar for a week

44:24

uh in the charts which is unheard of like at least unheard of I mean exactly

44:29

were calling me going we’ve never seen this like this is you know I mean there’s a demand for it right there’s a

44:35

there’s a thirst yeah for this kind of stuff and people want to know so and a new generation and a new generation yeah

44:43

yeah I mean it’s it’s tough because when you do a show like this you might mention a case

44:49

there are so many cases and that’s the point is you can’t do a deep dive on each of them if you want to see a deep

44:55

dive watch the documentaries that are out there you can watch Randy’s um documentary aerial phenomenon you can

45:01

see the phenomenon but it’s it is deep it is it is a deep well

45:08

is to find those stories that we feel are credible uh and be able to you know Spotlight

45:14

those where they haven’t been seen maybe in a new light or uh or get the respect that they should have

45:20

well gentlemen I I can’t thank you enough Dean it’s a pleasure to see you Martin it’s a pleasure thank you for

45:25

being persistent to get me on yes I do appreciate it was like look you bastard

45:32

it worked yeah anyway thank you so much James and have a safe trip over to

45:38

Europe and uh keep keep plugging on we all love you out here oh thank you so much right back at you guys all right

45:44

take care bye all right Gene so you would never leave

45:50

Jesus the guy just goes on and on it’s like the interview’s about him I don’t understand

45:57

yeah I know all right so what have you been up to Dean

46:03

um uh I finish in a new movie um that is a movie movie

46:08

um it’s called the last podcast and it’s a dark horror comedy and uh I

46:15

kid you not and it’s kind of based on my experiences hosting on your show

46:23

uh comedy uh no which was fantastic and um and was very inspiring and and um and

46:31

was terrific and and to get in a sense of the the audience and to get that immediacy back and forth and everything

46:36

I thought was just um was terrific so this is a real fun um kind of Twisted fable about this a

46:43

young podcaster trying to blow up and he’s a debunker and he debunks the supernatural and so um he uh goes ahead

46:53

and discovers one case um and it makes him a Believer uh but

46:58

the big you know twist is is he goes down a deep rabbit hole and does a

47:04

Faustian bargain in order to continue pulling in subscribers so uh I’ve seen

47:09

this happen to some of my friends who go oh I’m going to come into this Arena and do great and everything and it’ll eat you alive I mean you’re one of the OG’s

47:16

Martin and um and are still here and so um yeah so just finish that I’ve been

47:22

editing that um and um and then the other two documentaries

47:28

um that I’ve done the three-part series and the feature um I believe I’m going to be dropping

47:34

trailers for both of those at shag Harbor which um yeah we’ll meet up you’re not supposed

47:41

to know that we’re both going up there so we’re both we’re both speakers there that’ll be fun

47:47

to hang out again it’s been a little while a couple years but uh yeah so why

47:52

don’t you explain if you would what those once like you said a series of three and one is just basically a

48:00

standalone is that the one that’s on the experiencers yes yes um the the one that kind of came first

48:07

was again it was being on um uh for the new listeners

48:13

um I had made a film many years ago 30 plus years ago in fact it’s just been discovered by the

48:19

Europeans if you if you will oh no really yeah yeah so I am going to uh the

48:25

Citrus film festival and citrus film festivals in Spain uh Barcelona if

48:30

you’re a local Barcelona and um they are going to show that this program that’s called seven chances and they take seven

48:36

feature films that um or these kind of Cult Underground films mine was

48:43

um uh the purported first found footage film uh horror film made sci-fi film

48:48

ever made and uh that originally was called UFO Abduction incident uh uh no

48:54

that was the sequel um UFO k77 which later on ended up

48:59

becoming the McPherson tape and um yeah which people can still see um

49:05

um stream or Blu-ray et cetera anyway they um someone found it one of the

49:10

local film critics uh in Spain sought and so I’m going there to present the film and so anyway I had made this film

49:18

and the Baxter in the film was that um someone had edited off the credits and injected it to the UFO community so

49:25

for five years from 1989 until 84. it became this um this big underground film

49:33

where it ended up at the international UFO Congress convention where it was declared authentic by Lieutenant Colonel

49:40

with Air Force intelligence experience and a researcher and so I got calls from Unsolved Mysteries hard copy and a fox

49:46

show called encounters that wanted to know where this footage was found and so I was

49:53

very eager to debunk my own film there you go that’s it here’s the tape I love

49:59

this story this story is hilarious they took away your credits and then people are saying this really happened I

50:06

injected it into the UFO what had happened is a few Mom and Pop video stores got screeners Advanced screeners

50:12

of the film and then the not a joke not making this up the Distribution Company

50:18

Burns the ground so I lost my main master all my artwork and I thought that was it but then you know a few years

50:23

later this copy shows up and uh you know a big

50:28

scuttlebutt about it and then um so I go on this fox show I debunk the film and

50:34

I’m told still people still believe it’s real um well Dick Clark and Paramount love

50:39

the story so much they decided to do a remake so I redid the film in

50:46

1998 called alien abduction instant Lake County

50:51

um I think the original one is better we had Studio involvement Network involvement exec involvement and that is

50:57

never a good recipe and you got fired yeah yeah everyone got fired because everyone at the network got fired so we

51:04

came back we were like Hey we’re done with the film and they’re like hey get lost so um I’m in the director scale they

51:12

went after them and I got my credit reinstalled they’re reinstalled and everything so um anyway the anniversary

51:17

of the film came up and Alejandro Rojas and uh Karen uh broad

51:24

um invited me to go out there and or I invited myself because I love the uh love those guys and and went out

51:31

there and um and gave a uh kind of like a TED Talk 75 minute Ted talk about the

51:37

film and its journey and everything and yeah I was there that’s that’s when you and I met yes that’s right yeah we

51:43

didn’t swipe right it was at the convention okay all right so we didn’t swipe but it wasn’t Tinder

51:50

okay anyway uh so I went there and I thought well this will be interesting

51:56

because I’ve always been kind of an armchair amateur you know uh expert is stretching it in the UFO phenomenon in

52:03

fact my original film was based on Whitley strieber’s book communion the incidences and also close encounters Etc

52:10

um and so um the Kelly Hopkinsville story as well what’s in there so

52:15

I started meeting all of these people um like uh Dr Michael P Masters and and

52:23

um uh and God there’s so many of them uh people who are just Professionals in in

52:30

their line of work who have had experiences I’m talking about people who are Homeland Security supervisors people

52:36

have actually done TED Talks Architects chiropractors who are all highly credible to me and after doing 20 years

52:42

of crime shows I develop a pretty good I thought meter detector and then

52:47

I went and and met with these people when I was doing that and doing um alien

52:53

con and I thought well there’s something here that I can’t deny it because I’ve

52:58

done one into our documentaries for Bravo a e Etc I thought well this is a

53:04

space uncomfortable and I’m sure probably look into this and see if there’s a story here and then I hit on

53:10

um a line of looking at from a new point of view that hadn’t been done before and that was enough and that set me on a

53:16

five-year journey and out of that came this three-part series hang on just one second I just want to say goodbye to

53:22

everyone over at kgra radio and we’ll be back next week with Dr Keith Taylor great guy looking forward to talking to

53:29

him so uh continue on uh continue on sure so then um it was originally going

53:36

to be just a feature film 90 minutes in length I was going to do 15 interviews and then 60 interviews later a

53:43

three-part series came out of that and then um I ended up going to um with um

53:52

um with Yvonne Smith going to her alien abduction support group her experience her support group Ciro’s and that

53:59

devastated me that knocked me on my ass to put it lightly because

54:04

um you know I’m in a room with 15 people who all go around the room introduce themselves and what they do and they tell their stories and again not a blip

54:11

on my BS meter so at that point I when I would mention it to people I would see

54:17

the ridicule Factor and and that really um saddened me and I

54:23

decided all right even though I feel like I’ve really put everything in this three-part series I mean when you see it

54:29

it’s it is jam-packed three continents um I mean interviewing you know people

54:36

from uh Leslie Kane to um uh dynapasulka as well as the guy who

54:43

invented um Nick Bostrom Dr Nick Bostrom from Oxford who invented or created the

54:49

simulated reality hypothesis and we look at that I mean I look at it from NASA all the way through and so I thought

54:55

well that’s it I said everything I wanted to say and then after this I wanted to say something not from here

55:00

but from here which is you know I kind of use analogy when when people scoff at me when I talk about the experiencers

55:07

experience I will tell them you know yeah craft came and these they were taken and experiments were done Etc

55:13

and you know I can see in the rise a little chuckle myself okay let me let me change this for you for a second

55:19

what if I told you that I met this person that said that A van pulled up

55:25

and they were abducted and they were put inside and they were harassed and everything else and then

55:31

later on let out what would your response be would it be oh really it was a van was it white was

55:37

it a black van you know was it duct tape was it rope inside really you would never do that but these people suffer

55:44

from some of that John Mack new which is you can’t fake PTSD

55:49

and these people clearly are dealing with something heavy and they’ve been dealing with it their whole lives so

55:56

that set me off on another year doing this new documentary which may or may

56:02

not come out before the other one so anyway that’s the unpacking of those um two projects yeah yeah and is there

56:11

anything on the horizon that we may be able to access you said you’re going to

56:16

be putting out some possible trailers fairly soon but I mean the films themselves I know they’re uh they’re in

56:23

the uh the hands of someone that’s going to be uh getting them out there at this time right

56:29

well we are there on the the three-part plus the Standalone that’s what I’m

56:35

talking about the standalone it’s it I haven’t made a deal yet with oh I see some people with regards to

56:42

who’s going to rip the film to go out um and right now I’ve got uh a

56:48

Consortium of four people who want the project so that that is exciting um the other one is in a transition of

56:54

coming uh back and and we’re gonna see where that goes um but the thing that’s interesting and

57:01

challenging is you can make a feature doc and you can sell that and and you can

57:06

get it out there when you do a three-part series or limited series

57:11

um people that have done that before when you do it on your own and you show up it’s it is nearly impossible

57:19

to get apple to get Netflix to get these other companies to jump on board because

57:24

when you go and you talk to their unscripted Department the unscripted series Department that

57:30

means reality TV documentary series Department their development

57:35

they don’t do Acquisitions because no one is usually uh bold enough or dumb

57:42

enough to go and make that and I wanted to do it because I didn’t

57:47

want I had interference with Paramount and Dick Clark on the other one and so this one was very kind of special and I

57:53

wanted to incubate and have some time and Discover it without having this go on and so what came out of it is

57:58

something that has been pulling in a lot of interest um but it’s interesting because you do

58:04

have those people who you have to say to them no no watch it don’t just look at

58:09

and say well we don’t do Acquisitions take a look at it and then you know go from there and so right now all the

58:15

animating animation is uh is getting wrapped up and everything so it’s something that I was figured it would

58:22

come out um this year and the other one the following year but they may come out both of them this year so I’m very

58:28

excited about these things because it’s uh I worked really hard to pull in people

58:33

who don’t normally work in this field and to bring them in and say look I need you to sit down and consider this yeah

58:39

and I think that’s going to happen more and more as as we go along here and what

58:45

do you you know I know you had your head deep into the editing of this uh this

58:51

thing you were talking about this movie the latest thing that you’re involved in and so you you know I I would send you a

58:58

text and you you’re like well I can’t really look right now I’m right into the editing and all that so have you been

59:05

paying attention to anything at all uh lately I I on the at least on the

59:10

surface part of it and what are your thoughts yeah um I have been uh not as deeply as I

59:16

would um like to what I normally do but enough that I’ve read several articles on what’s going on

59:22

the stuff in Peru um I know you guys were talking about that so far it looks like

59:29

um there’s a chance that you know the guy who shot um one of these you know figures uh so

59:37

it looked like it was wearing a helmet and it was wearing kind of suit in fact they described the helmet as being like in Spider-Man the The Mask right yeah

59:45

that’s pretty specific so we need to get more information on that supposedly that’s been going on for like on and off

59:52

for a month and that was the big thing culminating the seven or eight feet tall thing

59:57

if you’re going to harass people minors if you’re doing that to keep the locals away

1:00:03

um that seems like a pretty far-reaching um way to do that however

1:00:09

um there’s a movie or a four-part series on who I believe it is called the

1:00:14

Sasquatch or Sasquatch and it’s about these drug dealers who faked a a Bigfoot

1:00:21

attack and these drug dealers were pretty Insidious they actually killed some um

1:00:27

local workers that were helping there as a demonstration and they mutilated them

1:00:32

and it was this terrifying thing but there has been a president presence of stuff like that being done beforehand

1:00:38

I’m not saying that that’s what’s going on I’m not saying that that’s what I’m endorsing I’m just saying that I you

1:00:43

know I want to look into that some more um I have two contacts two different contacts in Peru and one uh you know

1:00:51

wrote back to me and said ah you know I think it’s just a hoax uh didn’t really look into it deeply and then another one

1:00:57

who’s really looking into it he’s saying that a lot of things just don’t seem to

1:01:02

make sense about it and one of them being uh the jet packs he says look I know what the people like in that area

1:01:09

they’re very very poor and the miners are very poor unless they get really lucky and get you know a really good

1:01:14

amount of gold or whatever it is I think it’s gold uh but he says but he’s never

1:01:19

seen a jet pack in Peru in his life and he’s he’s lived there all his life and been all around and there’s no jet packs

1:01:27

I mean and they didn’t say anything about them making the jet packs are very

1:01:32

distinct in their noises they make and everything you know I mean there’s it’s just plain weird whatever it is it’s

1:01:38

plain weird and it may have you know an answer that you know it does belong to

1:01:44

someone trying to harass these people but it’s just strange yeah again I’d love to have footage I’d

1:01:51

love to have the locals be videotaping these guys filming them um another case that that’s a recent

1:01:57

case that that I just talked to someone recently and they said that they had communicated with someone

1:02:03

um um an intelligence that said that there was

1:02:08

some viability to the the the um the truth that the incident in Vegas

1:02:15

happened in Vegas yeah in Vegas yeah which ones that the

1:02:21

people seen you know these these uh aliens in their backyard that’s right and that came out the same week as David

1:02:27

grush you know came forward you know basically oh yeah it came out before the

1:02:32

hearing yeah and so it was kind of both were kind of conflated and it was just it just seemed too Fantastical and so I

1:02:40

might have to go back and and do another look into that um it sounds really interesting I I I

1:02:46

want to talk to this person and get more information on that uh which kind of annoys me because if it is it does seem

1:02:52

credible it means that I gotta dust off my camera and go back out there and well there was a detective that’s

1:02:59

working on that’s you know a skeptic detective uh that’s been putting some things out supposedly and he’s he’s kind

1:03:06

of puzzled by it from what I understand yeah yeah compliability to some other things

1:03:13

you know I mean but you know the odds are uh you know I mean they they came forward right after that uh thing was

1:03:20

seen on a a cam a dash cam I believe it was like uh and that was definitely like

1:03:26

something like a meteor I believe something along those lines of Fireball or whatever it was that had nothing to

1:03:32

do with it but it just happened to be that same night I guess well you know the dash cams aren’t

1:03:39

aren’t that high resolution and so you see something streaking across and people always talk about

1:03:45

um these these crafts being some of them being like the sun it was so bright it

1:03:51

comes out you know they see the fills the light fills their whole room um so

1:03:57

that yeah that’s that’s intriguing so I’m I’m considering going and and doing

1:04:04

a little bit of a deep dive uh over there and looking at that with regards to the hearing

1:04:09

um you know it’s a start I’m not going to get into the scuttlebutt about um the

1:04:14

stuff that came out uh there’s always going to be critics and stuff and um

1:04:20

um you know if if it’s you know if there’s some fire to this smoke it’ll

1:04:26

come out yeah you know it always does so otherwise I feel like

1:04:31

um you know we need to have more opportunities like that the thing to me that that’s most upsetting though is um

1:04:37

the um Republican rep uh Tim you can never remember his last name who

1:04:44

who engineered the whole Congressional hearing um Tim oh Timber

1:04:49

Burchette thank you for check I always want to say Birdwell um burchek

1:04:55

the fact that he went with his um with his uh kind of attaches and went to

1:05:03

to interview this whistleblower and then they got you know blocked by this uh

1:05:09

supposedly General who said we don’t care you don’t have the right to come here and intelligence defense

1:05:15

intelligence uh uh trumpshu which is and so that was disconcerting

1:05:20

because all this has been said the apparatus has been set up so that these people can come forward and then when they do this happens well that to me is

1:05:27

is um Kryptonite to getting the truth out there yeah right

1:05:33

yeah I I asked him what happened I wonder if I have that clip

1:05:39

now uh I asked him what happened I don’t have that clip readily available but uh

1:05:45

when he got bumped basically and he didn’t he didn’t want to talk about it he just said uh you know let’s move on

1:05:52

and you know this is this is bigger than that which uh you know it it is true and

1:05:58

I’m glad you know he felt that way instead of just walking away you know which he you know he could have done so

1:06:05

yeah no yeah I mean there’s a I don’t know what you’ve heard I haven’t heard

1:06:10

anything else but supposedly there’s going to be a senate hearing possibly in October

1:06:16

grumbling to that um I just feel like if you’re gonna do that you need to bring out the best

1:06:21

cases you need to to substantiate it um with things that move the narrative further along not things that kind of

1:06:29

reiterate what we’ve heard um because you know at the end of the day people are clamoring for that

1:06:36

material yeah that exotic material well the material itself doesn’t have to

1:06:42

be another component it doesn’t have to be metals that we don’t have if you look

1:06:48

at it being from another them being from another dimension or as you know Michael Masters uh

1:06:55

um you know his his um theory that he’s you know taken upon his

1:07:01

mantle to uh to carry which is that they’re from the future that would make total sense it would be earth materials

1:07:06

so I think it’s it’s more of getting something that shows intelligent design

1:07:11

that we haven’t done processing that we haven’t done and show me the goddamn bodies I want to

1:07:17

see the bodies yeah oh like Alejandro said when he was on the show right after uh uh David Rush

1:07:25

came out you know we need to see the receipts you know we need to it would be uh I don’t know here’s the problem I

1:07:33

think with that maybe I’m totally wrong I think I’m hearing your email pop in or something maybe yeah let me shut your

1:07:38

email yeah um so the problem with that is what are we ever going to

1:07:45

get to know you know what where is the line of what’s classified and what’s going to be available there are so many

1:07:53

uh ways they can put this umbrella over whatever it is to say we don’t want you

1:07:59

know our uh you know other countries to know that we know this could be one of it you know

1:08:06

I’m just our adversaries or whatever so we don’t want to share this type of thing so there’s so many different ways

1:08:11

they can block that type of stuff that you know even if they have a first-hand witness come forward what what can he

1:08:19

reveal other than talk right yeah it’s it’s strange because

1:08:26

um I you know I’m I’m um

1:08:31

I’m at heart I’m a skeptic not a debunker um by skeptic meaning that not and

1:08:38

skeptic isn’t the right word it’s been Twisted into you know you’re you’re someone who is a an agent of uh of

1:08:46

skepticism on something I’m an analyst I guess I would say I want to look at the material and I want to be able to

1:08:51

analyze it and right now the most compelling thing that has been the most compelling thing since the dawn of man

1:08:58

is witness testimony we still don’t have the bodies we don’t have the the craft and

1:09:06

so everything else is is just kind of hearsay and that’s it’s the person the messenger if you will that’s delivering

1:09:12

it and so that to me is still the case hasn’t changed and we can look at things and say well like I know Mick West said

1:09:19

what’s more realistic that um a uh a bunch of kids

1:09:25

saw at aerial School saw a UFO land couple UFOs land and some aliens get out

1:09:31

and had this communication with or A van pulled up and some guys took out some marionettes

1:09:38

and I’m like yeah well I I find equally find them equally uh challenging

1:09:46

however again I go with testimony and I go also with with what James Fox did which is uncover this woman who was on

1:09:52

the yard who witnessed this who knows the difference between marionettes not to mention that kids they know what Marianas like you know

1:09:59

what puppets look like so we need a better analogy than that but um until

1:10:04

that happens we’re still kind of you know based on our own experience and and I haven’t seen anything I did have a

1:10:12

very very strange dream so I don’t think I told you this two months ago uh don’t

1:10:18

worry you weren’t in it uh Martin um yeah and what the dream was is I was

1:10:25

in this like kind of um I was on this rooftop looking out and I saw this craft coming

1:10:31

and I looked and I went the thought in my head was oh

1:10:37

that’s a UFO there it is that’s what it looks like it’s making a little bit of a weird sound but there it is

1:10:43

and I’m looking at it and I’m going God that’s so crazy look at that and then it

1:10:48

lands and then I I see whoever gets out it gets a little jumbled in my dream and I

1:10:54

remember all the details but it was like we were communicating and and it was it was more of me kind of

1:11:01

watching and it was like okay we’re gonna go here now this and that and I remember in my head thinking oh that’s so strange look at them and I was

1:11:07

fascinated by the whole thing and um and and thinking that for the

1:11:14

experiencers I wonder if that was what it was like is you’re so if you’re not terrified you’re riveted by how strange

1:11:21

and surreal and it made me feel like you know they talk about high strangeness you know I talked with Earl Gray about

1:11:27

that all the time you know how great the high strangers is you can’t include it like don’t include Bigfoot in my UFO you

1:11:33

know sandbox um but it is that strange and everything and so when I woke up and everything I I

1:11:39

was talking to Charlie Parish our friend about it and uh and I said yeah I think that’s the

1:11:45

closest that that I’ve gotten to kind of having an understanding of when you see something that’s so absurd and shouldn’t exist what it does to you yeah and so

1:11:55

um I guess yeah go ahead no no I know from my own experience it was like

1:12:01

um it didn’t fit it didn’t fit my reality and uh you know just a a quick you know

1:12:09

recap for I I I’ve told the story a number of times but people ask me all the time can you tell your you know your

1:12:15

sighting it was It was kind of you know it wasn’t anything over exciting like some of the

1:12:20

um you know encounters that I heard but anyway I was in a hot tub I was not drinking I always have to say that and

1:12:27

uh something caught my eye and I looked up and it was Dusk and it was a blue

1:12:33

disc like a glowing blue disc you know went right over my head and the first thing I thought of was there’s

1:12:39

absolutely no sound how could this thing be flying and moving and I saw it stop too and be no sound at all

1:12:47

no you know no propulsion but the sound was very eerie to me when I was trying to like put in my mind right at that

1:12:55

moment like what am I seeing you know this isn’t what I’m supposed to be seeing you know it’s a very strange

1:13:01

feeling um yeah I mean buddy of mine is a fellow documentary

1:13:06

filmmaker um he never believed in the stuff in fact I think he was kind of put off that

1:13:13

that I had um um spent some time and in it professionally you know with

1:13:20

the documentaries and then he called me out of the blue and said hey can we talk

1:13:25

and I said yeah and it goes so um he said it’s taken me you know a few

1:13:31

weeks to to even talk about this but I was moving from one apartment to the

1:13:36

other and it was around four a.m at night and we were out in the deck kind of catching our breath because we had to

1:13:42

get everything moved and he’s going out of the country I think or something so anyway he said he was looking on the deck and

1:13:49

he sees this metallic craft moving along and it had a blue

1:13:55

glow around it really yeah the blue glow became more and more intense and then it

1:14:02

was like it like a little fire a little pulse and he said and then it was gone

1:14:08

and he said it’s really effed him up well you know that that’s only like the

1:14:13

third time I just asked the guy guess last week about anyone ever mentioned the blue glow because I’ve only heard it

1:14:19

a couple of times and now one more time oh really yeah yeah and he’d want to

1:14:24

talk about it and he wanted you know he was he was trying to get um like uh um in a way psychological

1:14:31

understand or help for this because he said it’s it’s really jacked me up

1:14:36

because I don’t believe in this stuff those are my favorite cases it’s like me too I love when people don’t believe in

1:14:42

it then it gets shown to them I wish that would happen to Mick West

1:14:48

well let me know this is this is a clip out the clip I was telling you about I know people have seen this before on my

1:14:54

channel but here it is hey Tim

1:15:00

Hey Brother Martin Wilson podcast UFO yeah nice to see you sure so uh you want

1:15:06

to put that on sure you’re not gonna do me like Fox and give me one that’s been somebody else’s ear

1:15:13

so I just wanted to thank you personally for all you’ve been doing thank you brother I appreciate it appreciate all

1:15:18

the coverage y’all been giving especially you brother I know you’ve been there at the Forefront of this thing a long time yeah I appreciate it

1:15:23

very much and uh I’m really sorry what happened I don’t know what happened it’s just politics dude it’s it’s no big deal

1:15:29

let’s let’s focus on the let’s not let’s focus exactly brother on the bigger picture it’s bigger than than me and all

1:15:36

this other stuff let’s get to the bottom of it this is a cover-up and we all know it yeah that’s right I absolutely agree

1:15:42

thank you so much all right really appreciate all your efforts yes sir so anyway you know here here you know

1:15:49

people will say well you know he’s Republican or they’ll say the other person’s Democrat but this is has

1:15:56

nothing to do with politics in my opinion it’s totally non-partisan and uh

1:16:02

you know he I think he is doing an excellent job you know pushing this thing and you know

1:16:09

someone had to do it I don’t care who it is but I mean and there is some mockery

1:16:15

you know of other of uh some other uh Congressman saying you know what a waste of time what a stupid thing you know

1:16:22

it’s really sad to see that because I thought everyone at the hearing was very respectful

1:16:27

and they asked really good questions and um there was that was it wasn’t a circus

1:16:34

like people are trying some people are trying to make it out to be in my opinion yeah no I mean it’s I’m on the fence

1:16:42

about it not being political um and why I say that is that whenever

1:16:51

um you know political nationality you are with your Republican Democrats or

1:16:56

you know the green uh the Green Team um if if you believe and you follow this

1:17:03

the phenomenon um you have to be aware that there’s two messages that these beings have been

1:17:08

saying since you know at least I think the first time I came it was in the 60s um well before where we’re at right now

1:17:15

which the two messages are um your technology isn’t helping you

1:17:20

which has been attributed to you know they’re not spelling out for us but which has been attributed to um uh

1:17:25

nuclear weapons and stuff I have anything that has to do with smartphones I think that makes maybe more sense

1:17:31

um but the other thing is you’re destroying your planet yeah

1:17:36

and that has gone on and on and on now we are going to be at that place if we don’t kill ourselves we’re going to be

1:17:42

at a place where we’re going to be visiting other civilizations if they exist and the chances everyone says you

1:17:47

know that the fact is numerology wise are number wise statistic wise there are

1:17:52

other planets that have life out there so we’re going to be checking them out and if we see telltale signs that they’re headed in

1:17:58

the same direction I would think that we would kind of say hey you might want to do this so when I hear that it’s not

1:18:03

politicized I’m kind of like well it is because that is our number one priority we are not going to be relocating to

1:18:10

another planet I’m sorry to say as much as we want to be able to perform that stuff that won’t happen by the time

1:18:15

what’s coming by all accounts seems to be coming I mean within the next five years anyone

1:18:21

who has been doubting this it just the statistics are and just the the

1:18:27

the experts in the research not just the experts I mean talking to people who I know live in Texas and stuff it’s

1:18:32

different who live in you know Florida um what’s going on the coast and stuff it’s it’s coming so you can still be a

1:18:40

republican uh and because I know that it’s it’s uh and our Democrat doesn’t

1:18:45

matter but even though the Democrats are known for being more climate conscious that’s how it’s reported in the news

1:18:52

um you can still believe it but you’ve got to vote to have those be those issues so I think with regards to

1:18:57

political agendas it is you know critical because all this doesn’t matter you know uh listening to podcasts it

1:19:05

doesn’t matter if we can’t survive we can’t go outside um and right now I don’t know how we’re

1:19:11

going to reverse this and I’m not expecting the aliens to come and say Here’s the technology and save us

1:19:17

because if that was going to happen they already would have you know I think dropped that off or maybe you know

1:19:23

inspired it in someone’s uh mind um you know whatever so

1:19:32

well I’m getting depressed I know it’s the reality of it you know the reality

1:19:37

of it but uh yeah it is uh it’s depressing when you really think about it and uh you know I mean I have been

1:19:43

told something from uh you know if a filmmaker that was doing some research

1:19:48

that was very Bleak when he reached out to all the world scientists to uh when

1:19:53

he was doing some back end work on on a series that was looking into Extinction

1:19:59

events so uh and it’s very they had they all

1:20:04

had uh you know very Bleak things to say about that scientist but but the thing

1:20:11

that that’s more terrifying is I’m like okay people can can challenge scientists because we do that now we can say Well

1:20:17

they’re scientists what does that mean what’s their agenda Etc talk to Farmers talk to people in agriculture yeah who

1:20:25

are suffering um the cost of food is going to go up Etc but we are going down a dark Road

1:20:31

here but it is it is something that again just to kind of umbrella this I think um that that is a

1:20:38

message that has come forward and I think I would want to listen if you’re not going to listen to

1:20:44

you know experts I would want to listen to someone who’s purported to be more advanced than us I want to be around to

1:20:50

be able to to be Star Trek you know I want to be able to go to other planets you know or other dimensions

1:20:57

yeah yeah well Dean I think we’re going to call it a night on a sad note

1:21:02

no no it’s always good to talk to you and again I I know I’ve said this last time you’re on but I uh when I was out

1:21:09

for uh surgery last October I want to thank you so much for covering for me uh when I could not you know I could not do

1:21:17

the show and you did a wonderful job and uh hope to see you behind a podcast mic

1:21:22

on your own at some point that would be great so uh and I’d be glad to help you

1:21:28

with that so thanks so much Dean you got it great seeing you again all right yeah

1:21:33

they want to talk soon okay all right okay everyone so next week as I

1:21:39

mentioned Dr Keith Taylor uh it should be a wonderful show and then the week after that I’m going to be in uh or that

1:21:46

next weekend I’ll be over at the mufon Symposium and uh if you’re going to be there uh please reach out to me it’d be

1:21:53

really fun to uh hang out and I might I just found out that I can’t do like a

1:21:59

show there or any type of recording there so I’m gonna have to try to figure that out see if I can do something

1:22:04

somewhere rent a room or something for that in particular all right we’ll see you next week and keep your eyes to the

1:22:10

sky [Music]

1:22:17

thank you [Music]